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  • vinnie
    replied
    Anybody who knows anything about genetic genealogy knows that Dr. McDonald is a retired professor who helped to develop FTDNA's original Population Finder, and who has since helped an untold number of people interpret their aDNA results for free, independent of FTDNA.

    Leave a comment:


  • josh w.
    replied
    Originally posted by KATM View Post
    Gemmy42, please review the forum guidelines before you make judgments about people.
    http://forums.familytreedna.com/faq....=guidelines_v1

    You are way off base and out of line.
    Yes, that was un-called-for. Taltos has been a very serious and dedicated contributor.

    Leave a comment:


  • KATM
    replied
    Gemmy42, please review the forum guidelines before you make judgments about people.
    http://forums.familytreedna.com/faq....=guidelines_v1

    You are way off base and out of line.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gemmy42
    replied
    Originally posted by Táltos View Post
    1. To clarify for you, your post #130 you said:
    Broadly is new terminology that is being used at 23andme, NOT at FTDNA.

    2. grahcom is the one who told everyone to take these tests with a grain of salt. And he/she is correct to a certain extent, especially where it regards FTDNA.

    3. Make no mistake, and really it is none of your business anyway, but I do not like wasting my money either. As I am quite certain none of the other people who take these tests do.

    4.You must be new, so I will explain more. My apologies for thinking everyone knows Dr. McDonald. No joke about Dr. McDonald. He has very generously given his time (for free) to analyzing probably over thousands of peoples raw DNA and giving them his analysis, as a lot of people had been unsatisfied with the old Population Finder. He has population samples that commercial genetic companies do not have ie Na-Dene, Sephardic to name a few. And he would give you a painting of your chromosomes, just like 23andme does. In this case you have a very helpful tool to assist you in your research. FTDNA has dropped the ball in providing this for us. Did you not read the part were I wrote it is a shame?

    5. And yes it is delightful. (Actual Customer) I can take my raw data that I paid for and upload it to an excellent site such as Gedmatch, and look at all of the admixture possibilities. I can determine which make the most sense. All for free too, unless I decide to give them a donation. Which they deserve for all they do.

    I don't see on their staff page any Dr. McDonald. Given that you're saying he is working for them, and give other details(that he's done this "for free"): how would you know that unless you are too? A "customer" and an EMPLOYEE too. The fact that you pay SO CLOSE attention to terminology that other companies are using, such that you know when they change it also tells me that you're spying on the competition. I hate this deceptive crap that people pull on these sites, where they "evalutate" the companies they work for. Guess what? The second independent lab came back with results that reflected what is in my family tree. THEY DID IT RIGHT! YOUR COMPANY IS RIPPING PEOPLE OFF! Of course, you already know that, that's why you're trying to defend their reputation in this forum. I want my money back, caiche?

    Leave a comment:


  • Táltos
    replied
    Originally posted by Gemmy42 View Post
    Who said anything about 23andme? As for taking it all "with a grain of salt", these people are supposed to be VERY SKILLED at determining these admixture results, not just "sort of right" "some of the time". Most people(unless they're members of the scientific community) are here to find out about their heritage(ethnic/racial percentages), because they are researching family history. I don't get your "Dr. McDonald" reference. Humor? I'm glad some (supposed) customers find it delightful to throw away their money on bullsh*t tests. I do not.
    1. To clarify for you, your post #130 you said:
    In my case, it had me as mostly Western European, and "Broadly" European(whatever that was supposed to mean).
    Broadly is new terminology that is being used at 23andme, NOT at FTDNA.

    2. grahcom is the one who told everyone to take these tests with a grain of salt. And he/she is correct to a certain extent, especially where it regards FTDNA.

    3. Make no mistake, and really it is none of your business anyway, but I do not like wasting my money either. As I am quite certain none of the other people who take these tests do.

    4.You must be new, so I will explain more. My apologies for thinking everyone knows Dr. McDonald. No joke about Dr. McDonald. He has very generously given his time (for free) to analyzing probably over thousands of peoples raw DNA and giving them his analysis, as a lot of people had been unsatisfied with the old Population Finder. He has population samples that commercial genetic companies do not have ie Na-Dene, Sephardic to name a few. And he would give you a painting of your chromosomes, just like 23andme does. In this case you have a very helpful tool to assist you in your research. FTDNA has dropped the ball in providing this for us. Did you not read the part were I wrote it is a shame?

    5. And yes it is delightful. (Actual Customer) I can take my raw data that I paid for and upload it to an excellent site such as Gedmatch, and look at all of the admixture possibilities. I can determine which make the most sense. All for free too, unless I decide to give them a donation. Which they deserve for all they do.
    Last edited by Táltos; 30 June 2014, 11:08 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gemmy42
    replied
    Originally posted by Táltos View Post
    When you say "Broadly European" that is actually a renaming of the "Nonspecific" category at 23andme. No for me, the old PF was not better. It is essentially the same, but the new can call me almost half Eastern European instead of predominately Western European (French and Orcadian) in the old PF which was not true.

    Sure take them with a grain of salt like grahcom suggested, but then I guess these companies should not even bother to offer this as part of the product. Really I do find the admixture part to be fun, but I want it to help me a little bit with the brick walls that I have.

    Let's say you find you never knew you had a certain ancestry. You get a bunch of matches on a certain chromosome that are of the same ancestry. Then hey the admixture test gives you a percentage for that ancestry, and then lo and behold that chromosome where you have those matches is painted with that same ancestry. Pretty cool, and does happen....at 23andme. Could maybe happen for you here if your Dr. McDonald analysis also can show this in a chromosome painting. Shame this update did not have chromosome painting. But then again this left a lot to be desired.....


    Who said anything about 23andme? As for taking it all "with a grain of salt", these people are supposed to be VERY SKILLED at determining these admixture results, not just "sort of right" "some of the time". Most people(unless they're members of the scientific community) are here to find out about their heritage(ethnic/racial percentages), because they are researching family history. I don't get your "Dr. McDonald" reference. Humor? I'm glad some (supposed) customers find it delightful to throw away their money on bullsh*t tests. I do not.
    Last edited by Gemmy42; 30 June 2014, 10:32 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Táltos
    replied
    Originally posted by Gemmy42 View Post
    Don't trust the results "My Origins" spits out. The "Population Finder" was more accurate. In my case, it had me as mostly Western European, and "Broadly" European(whatever that was supposed to mean). My Origins shows British Isles, Eastern Europe, as well as "Middle Eastern(3%)": North Africa and Eastern Middle East. I knew there was something wrong with these results, as I have no known Middle Eastern or Eastern European ancestors. I sent it off to another lab, and they produced the results I expected(according to family surnames, and what I've been told of their countries of origin). FTDNA is WRONG in their computations and what are apparently shot-in-the-dark assumptions. They're just ripping people off, from what I can tell. GET A SECOND OPINION!
    When you say "Broadly European" that is actually a renaming of the "Nonspecific" category at 23andme. No for me, the old PF was not better. It is essentially the same, but the new can call me almost half Eastern European instead of predominately Western European (French and Orcadian) in the old PF which was not true.

    Sure take them with a grain of salt like grahcom suggested, but then I guess these companies should not even bother to offer this as part of the product. Really I do find the admixture part to be fun, but I want it to help me a little bit with the brick walls that I have.

    Let's say you find you never knew you had a certain ancestry. You get a bunch of matches on a certain chromosome that are of the same ancestry. Then hey the admixture test gives you a percentage for that ancestry, and then lo and behold that chromosome where you have those matches is painted with that same ancestry. Pretty cool, and does happen....at 23andme. Could maybe happen for you here if your Dr. McDonald analysis also can show this in a chromosome painting. Shame this update did not have chromosome painting. But then again this left a lot to be desired.....

    Leave a comment:


  • grahcom
    replied
    Why oh why can't folk get it!!!! Treat admixture results with a pinch of salt and that we shouldn't take the results literally from any company. We can only make general statements about the results. The results are skewed to the database sample used.

    Leave a comment:


  • Germanica
    replied
    Originally posted by Gemmy42 View Post
    Don't trust the results "My Origins" spits out. The "Population Finder" was more accurate. In my case, it had me as mostly Western European, and "Broadly" European(whatever that was supposed to mean). My Origins shows British Isles, Eastern Europe, as well as "Middle Eastern(3%)": North Africa and Eastern Middle East. I knew there was something wrong with these results, as I have no known Middle Eastern or Eastern European ancestors. I sent it off to another lab, and they produced the results I expected(according to family surnames, and what I've been told of their countries of origin). FTDNA is WRONG in their computations and what are apparently shot-in-the-dark assumptions. They're just ripping people off, from what I can tell. GET A SECOND OPINION!
    They are not necessarily "wrong", 3% is only a trace amount which could just be statistical noise, something ALL DNA companies are subject to.

    Also, the 3% Middle East could be coming from a different region which has some similar DNA to Middle Easterns. My results come up with 17% Middle East (which is much lower than what the original Population Finder said it was) even though I have no known Middle Eastern heritage. But I know this is coming from my Italian/Sicilian side, who often share DNA with Middle Easterners, making it difficult or impossible to tell apart sometimes. That is not FTDNA's fault, it's just the nature of DNA right now. The same thing might be happening with the Eastern European results - you don't say what percentage they gave you for that - is it another small number or higher?

    All ethnic percentages from ANY DNA company are estimates and subject to interpretation.

    I do agree that getting a second opinion can be very beneficial, regardless of what company you first tested with.
    Last edited by Germanica; 29 June 2014, 07:52 AM.

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  • Armando
    replied
    Originally posted by gatty View Post
    I think it's best to treat admixture results with a pinch of salt. For example Geno 2 North European 45 Mediterranean 36 SW Asian 17 Native American 2(accept probably noise) which contrasts with My origins 69 British isles 30 Scandinavia 1 North Africa .
    Dr Mcdonald gave me French= 0.292 Irish= 0.708 or
    Irish= 0.865 Tuscan= 0.135 or
    English= 0.875 Russian= 0.125 or
    Irish= 0.844 Italian= 0.156 or
    English= 0.867 Finland= 0.133 or
    French= 0.669 Finland= 0.331 or
    English= 0.932 Chuvash= 0.068 or
    Irish= 0.418 English= 0.582 or
    Irish= 0.928 Sardinia= 0.072
    Gedmatch also gives me sizeable east European and Mediterranean which is not reflected in My origins . As things stand they should be treated as amusing/interesting guesstimates.
    Your Geno 2.0 shows you to be close to Germans which is western European with a small amount of another component.

    See https://genographic.nationalgeograph...e-populations/

    Your MyOrigins shows you to be western and northern European with a small amount of another component.

    Dr. McDonald shows you to be western European with a mix of another group.

    They all agree that you are mostly western European but mixed with another group.

    That shows we can't take the results literally from any company. We can only make general statements about the results.

    Leave a comment:


  • gatty
    replied
    I think it's best to treat admixture results with a pinch of salt. For example Geno 2 North European 45 Mediterranean 36 SW Asian 17 Native American 2(accept probably noise) which contrasts with My origins 69 British isles 30 Scandinavia 1 North Africa .
    Dr Mcdonald gave me French= 0.292 Irish= 0.708 or
    Irish= 0.865 Tuscan= 0.135 or
    English= 0.875 Russian= 0.125 or
    Irish= 0.844 Italian= 0.156 or
    English= 0.867 Finland= 0.133 or
    French= 0.669 Finland= 0.331 or
    English= 0.932 Chuvash= 0.068 or
    Irish= 0.418 English= 0.582 or
    Irish= 0.928 Sardinia= 0.072
    Gedmatch also gives me sizeable east European and Mediterranean which is not reflected in My origins . As things stand they should be treated as amusing/interesting guesstimates.

    Leave a comment:


  • Gemmy42
    replied
    Don't trust the results "My Origins" spits out. The "Population Finder" was more accurate. In my case, it had me as mostly Western European, and "Broadly" European(whatever that was supposed to mean). My Origins shows British Isles, Eastern Europe, as well as "Middle Eastern(3%)": North Africa and Eastern Middle East. I knew there was something wrong with these results, as I have no known Middle Eastern or Eastern European ancestors. I sent it off to another lab, and they produced the results I expected(according to family surnames, and what I've been told of their countries of origin). FTDNA is WRONG in their computations and what are apparently shot-in-the-dark assumptions. They're just ripping people off, from what I can tell. GET A SECOND OPINION!
    Attached Files

    Leave a comment:


  • PDHOTLEN
    replied
    /Users/PDHOTLEN/Desktop/Screen Shot 2014-06-26 at 12.28.54 AM.png

    I give up...

    Leave a comment:


  • Mars
    replied
    Can you help me interpret my results? I'm of full northern italian heritage. I should fall into the southern Europe +western/central Europe category, anyways my results are 69% southern european (regular), 16% Asia minor (I think it's quite regular for a southern european, and for a native european in general), and 16% scandinavian. Is the latter a signal of "barbaric" (early Middle Ages) input in my family? I have no scandinavian relatives, as far as I know... A swedish user of FTDNA is a "distant relative" of mine (5th grade cousin), along with many brits and some other northern italians. Here is my "map", have your say...
    [IMG][/IMG]

    Leave a comment:


  • Lappen
    replied
    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    This result shows that their methods are far from perfect.
    Yes! It seems like this method is having a hard time to separate the Scandinavian cluster from Finland and North Siberia.

    Leave a comment:

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