Is it possible not to have inherited...

[rachelleleclaire]

A Lutheran peasant woman born in 1842 had 3 illegitimate children with an unknown father, two boys and a girl. I have tested 6 of their descendants – 1 from the daughter(AS), 2 from son #1(IA and KA) and 3 from son #2 (EA, RL, JO), including myself. All testees, excluding myself (RL) are great grandchildren of the illegitimate 3, making them 3rd cousins. Amount of shared DNA suggests they all had the same father, however, two cousins, KA and AS have a higher Ashkenazi ethnic component than the rest, and it’s on their shared segments, their shared matches sound Jewish, there’s tons of matches, etc. JO and AS are a strong X-Match from the Lutheran mother. But EA and RL have no Ashkenazi ethnic results at all, and are the only two who do not match AS. The only hint at a Jewish connection for EA and RL is, though they share a large segment with KA, their only shared match is a Russian Jewish woman.

My question is: is it possible for RL and EA to have not inherited any of this Jewish component at all, by chance and the randomness of recombination? Could the unknown father have been mostly Jewish? Or perhaps his parents were also a mixed religion couple (this was in imperial Russia, where being Jewish earned you more years in the Czar’s army, so conversions were a possibility).

I’m thinking the unknown father could have been Jewish, explaining why he had a lasting relationship with the Lutheran mother without every marrying..

Theres a little diagram at this link illustrating the relationships here in more detail:

https://chelli11.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/presentation1akk.jpg

[Frederator]

You're sure that son #2 had the same father as the daughter and son #1? I wouldn't infer too much simply by the volume of shared DNA. I have a 3rd cousin who shares nearly 50 cM more with me than a 2nd cousin from the same branch of my family.

JO has many Ashkenazi results? I myself have a couple. Sort of. I mean, I have a small handful of matches that are partially or mostly of Jewish origin.

But I figured if it really indicated Jewish ancestry on my part, there would be absolutely tons of people sharing parts of the same segment, which there are not. On balance I think the proper explanation is that those other people have some distant Christian ancestry of which they are unaware.

Which was a shame because some branches of my family had a Jewish ancestor legend that I can now consider unsubstantiated.

A Lutheran peasant woman born in 1842 had 3 illegitimate children with an unknown father, two boys and a girl. I have tested 6 of their descendants – 1 from the daughter(AS), 2 from son #1(IA and KA) and 3 from son #2 (EA, RL, JO), including myself. All testees, excluding myself (RL) are great grandchildren of the illegitimate 3, making them 3rd cousins. Amount of shared DNA suggests they all had the same father, however, two cousins, KA and AS have a higher Ashkenazi ethnic component than the rest, and it’s on their shared segments, their shared matches sound Jewish, there’s tons of matches, etc. JO and AS are a strong X-Match from the Lutheran mother. But EA and RL have no Ashkenazi ethnic results at all, and are the only two who do not match AS. The only hint at a Jewish connection for EA and RL is, though they share a large segment with KA, their only shared match is a Russian Jewish woman.

My question is: is it possible for RL and EA to have not inherited any of this Jewish component at all, by chance and the randomness of recombination? Could the unknown father have been mostly Jewish? Or perhaps his parents were also a mixed religion couple (this was in imperial Russia, where being Jewish earned you more years in the Czar’s army, so conversions were a possibility).

I’m thinking the unknown father could have been Jewish, explaining why he had a lasting relationship with the Lutheran mother without every marrying..

Theres a little diagram at this link illustrating the relationships here in more detail:
https://chelli11.files.wordpress.com...tation1akk.jpg

[rachelleleclaire]

As far as being sure via paper trail that son#1 and son#2 had the same father, no. The genealogical records I’d normally chase down are lost for the time period they were born in. I simplified the case a bit though in my original post, just for ease of explaining. The Lutheran mother actually very likely had 4 sons 1863-1870, then two daughters in 1872 and 1878 – only the 3 children I mentioned survived to have children. The two daughters I have baptismal records for, were illegitimate, and their baptisms state the mother had never been married. For the sons, the records were destroyed/missing. Its unlikely this woman would have just chosen to have 6 children with random men in her time and age, and manage to raise them as she did with no financial support. DNA has at least proven some relation of all these cousins – the illegitimate children were able to adopt an invented surname under the rules of their area, and my theory always was that everyone with this unique surname was related – we are!). Later records show the 6 illegitimate kids as being godparents to each other’s children, strongly suggesting family ties.

Everyone matches within the expected range for their assumed relation, except AS, my last tester, who has shown up especially close to JO, but with no Ashkenazi matches in common (JO has only a few potential Ashkenazi matches, but not what you would expect for Ashkenazi). AS also matches KA, but not IA.

Further complicating things – KA and IA are half second cousins, sharing a great grandfather but different great grandmothers. And JO is actually a double second cousin to EA and 2C1X removed to RL – their grandparents were a brother and a sister from one family who married a brother and a sister from another family.

If AS matches JO, he must be related to EA and RL. AS and JO are also an X-match, which fits my theory, their X segment would have come from the Lutheran mother.

If AS matches KA, he must be related to IA.

Leading me to believe that the appropriate generation for them to share a MCRA is that illegitimate father…



We’re on Gedmatch – most of us.

T463049 is EA

T473231 is AS

A449628 is JO

T677231 is KA

T773912 is RL