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FTDNA Going Autosomal!

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  • #31
    The 22 autosomals - are they the same ones that DNA Tribes does? STR markers?

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    • #32
      Originally posted by rainbow View Post
      The 22 autosomals - are they the same ones that DNA Tribes does? STR markers?
      Yes, everyone has 22 pairs of autosomals and these chromosomes are what's tested by FTDNA's new Family Finder test, the DNA Tribes test and 23andMe.

      However, the results from FTDNA's Family Finder, like 23andMe, are SNPs. Family Finder will test about 500,000 SNPs, about the same as 23andMe, with significant, but not complete overlap. DNA Tribes tests autosomal STRs, which are nowhere near as useful for genetic genealogy as SNPs are.

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      • #33
        ok thanks.

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Kathleen Carrow View Post
          Gosh..I am surprised you have not used it! We could be relatives!
          i took the 23andme test mainly for the admixture percentages. i was expecting it to somewhat confirm my ancestrybydna result of 17% native amerian, but 23andme says 0% asian (they don't have a separate category for native american, so i expected it to show up in my asian score).

          maybe i am the only person who found the 23andme website too difficult. i downloaded my raw data on my laptop to read later but it was in unicode or something i don't understand. to this day i haven't seen what my 500,000+ snps are and what they mean. as far as population matches go, there is nothing specific. the northern european column has the higher percentage but there are many columns that are almost the same as that.

          i remember you now. you had salish scores from dnatribes around the same time or before i did dnatribes. i had athabaskan scores. that was when they only did 13 markers. i don't match athabaskan now

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          • #35
            Originally posted by rainbow View Post
            The 22 autosomals - are they the same ones that DNA Tribes does? STR markers?
            (not STRS they are SNPS..)
            you do not need to know anything about how to read your Raw data to do other things. I don't.

            I did not do it for the population data although I learned a great deal from OTHER people comparing my Data..which indicated my Norwegian/possible Sami.

            I did all 21 markers eventually at DNA Tribes..they indicated it looked exactly the same
            for me and my sister but they finally refined it to Polish or Russian and did reference tribal faction.

            Since my now known grandfather was from a North Norway area very close to Finland and having a large Sami population it all makes sense.
            You have to keep working at it to find things out.It does take a lot of work but worthwhile.
            Last edited by Kathleen Carrow; 20 February 2010, 10:52 AM.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by Kathleen Carrow View Post
              (not STRS they are SNPS..)
              you do not need to know anything about how to read your Raw data to do other things. I don't.

              I did not do it for the population data although I learned a great deal from OTHER people comparing my Data..which indicated my Norwegian/possible Sami.

              I did all 21 markers eventually at DNA Tribes..they indicated it looked exactly the same
              for me and my sister but they finally refined it to Polish or Russian and did reference tribal faction.

              Since my now known grandfather was from a North Norway area very close to Finland and having a large Sami population it all makes sense.
              You have to keep working at it to find things out.It does take a lot of work but worthwhile.
              Thanks.
              I decided to log in to my 23andme this afternoon but my password doesn't work. Waiting for an email from 23andme to reset it. Hasn't come yet.

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              • #37
                tried again and now my password worked and i'm in.
                still didn't get an email from them.

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                • #38
                  23andme emailed me about a potential fourth cousin just over a week ago. I just logged in and replied. I hope it's true.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Kathleen Carrow View Post
                    (not STRS they are SNPS..)
                    you do not need to know anything about how to read your Raw data to do other things. I don't.

                    I did not do it for the population data although I learned a great deal from OTHER people comparing my Data..which indicated my Norwegian/possible Sami.

                    I did all 21 markers eventually at DNA Tribes..they indicated it looked exactly the same
                    for me and my sister but they finally refined it to Polish or Russian and did reference tribal faction.

                    Since my now known grandfather was from a North Norway area very close to Finland and having a large Sami population it all makes sense.
                    You have to keep working at it to find things out.It does take a lot of work but worthwhile.
                    Congratulations on discovering your not-Salish but Norwegian Grandfather. That was a lot of searching.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by rainbow View Post
                      Congratulations on discovering your not-Salish but Norwegian Grandfather. That was a lot of searching.
                      I am glad you signed in to 23andme..who knows? It could be meaningful!

                      My Norwegian grandfather was my Dad's stepfather although Dad was doubtful about him being his father. Not sure why but I suspect that when grandpop went back to sea ( he was a merchant sailor) Grandmom may have had a relationship with someone else.

                      Twice in my hearing Grandpop Boe indicated he was Dad's father. They had very similar looks, fair and blue eyed and they wore the same size shoes..small, narrow.They were about the same size.Both soft spoken

                      Dad was raised by his Grandmother after the age of 3 and she adopted him.grandfather told me he "always sent them money".

                      Norwegian records being very very good I now know he (GF) was left fatherless as the baby of 6 children. His mother had another child which she adopted out and seems to have disappeared. His grandmother seems to have raised his older brother and from something he told me when I was young, she likely was his mother figure also.His father was an only child and the grandmother was widowed. So he had his own issues.

                      When my results came back..I was told they looked very Irish ( which I am ) but with a Finnish or Norwegian Native element.
                      I went back and pulled up grandpop's immigration records and he was born in Bjarkoy Troms..right in the Sami area. Then I immediately got 6-8 Norwegian cousin matches.Eventually I have found 4 of those families in the Norwegian records as being from the same place as GF.

                      Anyway, thanks and glad you opened up your account. Yell if you need help to me ..I am "Katie C" there.
                      Kathleen

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                      • #41
                        This is fascinating, but I cannot see myself participating. Monetary issues aside, it seems this only tests for possible relatives AND said possible relatives must test as well.
                        It seems to much to spend just to MAYBE find out I might be related to someone. If I could find lost-cousins through family trees and non-genetic sources, I wouldn't need this test. Kind of a catch 22 I suppose.

                        Although I do have half siblings and often wonder just how much of our parent's DNA we share.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Elistariel View Post
                          This is fascinating, but I cannot see myself participating. Monetary issues aside, it seems this only tests for possible relatives AND said possible relatives must test as well.
                          It seems to much to spend just to MAYBE find out I might be related to someone. If I could find lost-cousins through family trees and non-genetic sources, I wouldn't need this test. Kind of a catch 22 I suppose.

                          Although I do have half siblings and often wonder just how much of our parent's DNA we share.
                          Yes, you're right. The chance that you're related to someone in a DNA database may be very small. It all depends on how large the database is and how common your ancestry is. If your ancestry is at least 1/4 northern European (especially British Isles) or Jewish, you would be surprised about how many distant cousins you would find in a database of tens of thousands of people. If you're of southern European or non-European ancestry, you won't have many distant cousins in the same size database.

                          Just think about how many ancestors you had a few generations ago - 4 grandparents, 8 great-grandparents, 16 gg-grandprarents, 32 ggg-grandparents, 64 gggg-grandparents, etc. If you and someone else have a common ancestor with a pair of your gggg-grandparents, that makes them a 5th cousin. Now think about how many 5th cousins you may have if every pair of your gggg-grandparents had an average of 3 children who lived to adulthood and each generation of their descendants also averaged 3 children who lived to adulthood and had more children. I won't do the math, but you have more 5th cousins than you probably think you have.

                          To give you an example, 23andMe has a database of 30,000 customers. It's very common for 23andMe customers with Jewish ancestry to have several hundred predicted distant cousins found, based on shared DNA; some with full Jewish ancestry, have 800-1,000 predicted cousins. (European Jews are heavily intermarried for hundreds of years.) Those with northern European ancestry generally have 100-200 predicted cousins. If you have southern European ancestry, you'll have less than 50 predicted cousins. I have 100% Italian ancestry and I have 21 predicted cousins in 23andMe's database. Yet, going against all the odds, I'm in contact with one predicted 3rd cousin, who turns out to be a previously unknown 2nd cousin!

                          Now consider this. FTDNA has a customer database of over 100,000, at least 3 times the size of 23andMe. However, at first FTDNA will only have a relatively small percentage of its customers who order Family Finder and are in the database for autosomal comparisons. So, those who order early are helping build the database, but FTDNA's database can be significantly larger than 23andMe's. This is especially true since FTDNA's initial price for Family Finder is $150 less than the Ancestry edition of 23andMe.

                          Consider all that when you weigh whether ordering Family Finder is worthwhile to you.

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                          • #43
                            I may have missed this, but do you have to provide a new sample for Family Finder.

                            Last summer, after I had my dad upgrade to mtDNA FGS, I had Family Tree DNA send another test kit... just in case. I told them he was 91 & you never know. He returned the sample, but his FGS results were posted before they even received the sample. He died on Dec. 25, 2009.

                            So I am wondering if Family Tree DNA could go ahead & use that sample.

                            My mother is also deceased, but her brother has already been tested for y-DNA. I am thinking about ordering the Family Finder test for him, if Family Tree DNA can use his existing sample.

                            Of course, I could just upgrade myself & have my own results added to the database, but I think I would get a weaker signal of kinship than I would with relatives one generation back.

                            Timothy Peterman

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by T E Peterman View Post
                              I may have missed this, but do you have to provide a new sample for Family Finder.
                              Here's what FTDNA wrote to me when I placed my FF order:

                              "Due to the large amount of DNA required for this product, we must extract DNA from a previously unused vial. We will mail you a kit with swabs and vials to collect additional samples shortly."

                              In other cases people seem to be receiving FF results without the need to provide fresh samples.

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                              • #45
                                Mike,

                                Thank you for the very informative posting. So it seems that this type of testing is most useful for people who have no idea of who their family is (e.g., adoptees), people who have experienced forced separations (e.g., Holocaust victims), or people who've just lost contact with their extended families; e.g., Americans who've been in the U.S. for hundreds of years. The main reason I'm considering this testing is because my father's maternal grandmother was adopted, but given the relatively small numbers of central Italians in any of the databases, I wonder if it'll be worth the cost; the FGS my dad did for her line hasn't produced one single exact match - not even in HVR1 or 2.
                                Last edited by vinnie; 22 February 2010, 07:19 AM.

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