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  • Greece Y

    Dienekes in his blog posted a link to an article on Greek and Cretan Y dna. Unfortunately, I don't have access to the article. It seems however the article may have interesting information about the E3b and J2 present in Greece and its relation to European and Anatolian one. In practice, the article seems to say that Greece doesn't show too much similarity to Anatolia.

    cacio

  • #2
    Originally posted by cacio
    Dienekes in his blog posted a link to an article on Greek and Cretan Y dna. Unfortunately, I don't have access to the article. It seems however the article may have interesting information about the E3b and J2 present in Greece and its relation to European and Anatolian one. In practice, the article seems to say that Greece doesn't show too much similarity to Anatolia.

    cacio
    Cacio,

    If you send me the link, I'll see if I can get the article for you. I have access to a lot of journals.

    Vinnie

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    • #3
      vinnie:

      Dienekes has the link on his page (current top post):

      http://dienekes.blogspot.com/

      cacio

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      • #4
        I have looked at the Crete/Greece paper. I have not been following the literature on J and E3b, so I don't know how new or interesting the results are - people who have looked at these two haplogroups will know.

        But anyway, one point I had not appreciated is that in Greece there is very little J2a and a good amount of J2b (relative to other nearby places). Whereas Anatolia displays more J2a, as does Crete. This fact is taken as an indication that Crete was populated from Anatolia. Moreover, it also seems to indicate a more complicated neolithic influence of Anatolia on Greece.

        There are bits of info on I as well (though I didn't understand them), and almost nothing on R1b (though it is common, around 15-20% even in Crete), except a citation from a paper that tantalizingly says something about the similarity of R1b of Italy and Crete.

        cacio

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        • #5
          I haven't read the article yet, but I wonder if there will be any studies that conclusively show that the Indo-European tribes (Myceneans of Homer) subjugated an indigenous people in mainland Greece and then proceeded to invade and subjugate the Minoans.
          That would be very interesting for someone like me who had been interested in this issue for almost 30 decades.

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          • #6
            Hando:

            the article focuses on the earlier neolithic contribution, so it doesn't say much about these later event. The one thing it suggests is that the presence of E3b-V13 in Crete may indicate mainland influence consistent with the demise of the Minoans. But E3b-V13 is not the main haplogroup in Crete (that's J2), so they estimate that the overall contribution of this event could be at most 20%.

            Nothing is said about indoeuropeans etc. in Greece. The paper just mentions the possibility that J2b in mainland greece may be consistent with the Anatolian theory of indoeuropean language, but only in the sense that it was a movement from Anatolia to Greece around that time. Other than that, it's really hard to discern anything that may indicate some more recent Indoeuropean/micenean invasion and replacement of local populations.

            cacio

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            • #7
              Thanks Cacio, I will read that article when I have more time. All my best.

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