V12

[Jeff H]

I am trying to make sense out of the information on the V12 haplogroup. When I try searching for mtDNA haplogroup origins, I get a long list of possible countries under HVR1 MATCHES (only 11 of them V12), no matches under HVR1 AND HVR2 MATCHES, and under HVR1, HVR2, AND CODING REGION MATCHES with GENETIC DISTANCE -1 I find three entries, one with no location, one with England, and one with two hits for UNITED STATES (Native American)-- all of them V12. Under mtDNA matches I get six people listed, four with a genetic distance of 1 and two with a genetic distance of 3. Is the V12 haplotype really rare (my wife had over 500 mtDNA matches for her different haplotype)?

From looking at people on my mtDNA matches, I find a few with oldest direct female ancestors in New York, which matches the earliest I am sure of, but I don't see a name match with me. How does that relate to the haplotype origins?

How probable is a real native American mtDNA origin? To the best of my knowledge that line is mainly Puritans, but with many uncertainties. Any ideas?

[gattaca]

You can see the public mtdna haplotree for V12 on these links:

https://www.familytreedna.com/public/mt-dna-haplotree/V;name=V12

https://www.yfull.com/mtree/V12/

[KATM]

mtDNA haplogroup V is not known to be a Native American haplogroup. See Roberta Estes' 2017 blog post, "New Native American Mitochondrial DNA Haplogroups" for a list of the mtDNA haplogroups that are confirmed Native American. Eupedia shows V12 as being found in Germany. The Haplogroup.org page for mtDNA haplogroup V12 shows V12 to be between 200 and 7,000 years old, per the paper by Behar et al in 2012.

I would say that your FullSequence match showing United States (Native American) either mistakenly used that description thinking it meant a person born in the United States (thus a "native"), or believes his or her earliest direct maternal ancestor was Native American, but she was not.

[DWFlineage]

I am trying to make sense out of the information on the V12 haplogroup. When I try searching for mtDNA haplogroup origins, I get a long list of possible countries under HVR1 MATCHES (only 11 of them V12), no matches under HVR1 AND HVR2 MATCHES, and under HVR1, HVR2, AND CODING REGION MATCHES with GENETIC DISTANCE -1 I find three entries, one with no location, one with England, and one with two hits for UNITED STATES (Native American)-- all of them V12. Under mtDNA matches I get six people listed, four with a genetic distance of 1 and two with a genetic distance of 3. Is the V12 haplotype really rare (my wife had over 500 mtDNA matches for her different haplotype)?

From looking at people on my mtDNA matches, I find a few with oldest direct female ancestors in New York, which matches the earliest I am sure of, but I don't see a name match with me. How does that relate to the haplotype origins?

How probable is a real native American mtDNA origin? To the best of my knowledge that line is mainly Puritans, but with many uncertainties. Any ideas?

My mtdna haplogroup is V19; which is downstream of V12, just read a few papers that indicate V12 found in Germany? I have successfully traced my paternal line a thousand years back to Romerike, Norway. I have read where V19 has Sammi roots in Sweden.

Best regards, Doug

[Jeff H]

Thanks very much for the links, which help a lot. Earlier digging found no verification of family legends of Native Americans in two lineages from upstate New York, but many pieces are missing from the puzzle. A German ancestry is plausible; most of my maternal lineage is Puritan, but the new My Origins 3 now shows me with Central European rather than British Isles origin. However, I can't trace my maternal line reliably before 1779.

Plenty of puzzles remain; a recent New York Times photo of a Mexican-american activist of the early 1900s could have been an identical twin sister of my maternal grandmother at the same time, but maybe I was fooled by the clothing and hairdo.

[DWFlineage]

Thanks very much for the links, which help a lot. Earlier digging found no verification of family legends of Native Americans in two lineages from upstate New York, but many pieces are missing from the puzzle. A German ancestry is plausible; most of my maternal lineage is Puritan, but the new My Origins 3 now shows me with Central European rather than British Isles origin. However, I can't trace my maternal line reliably before 1779.

Plenty of puzzles remain; a recent New York Times photo of a Mexican-american activist of the early 1900s could have been an identical twin sister of my maternal grandmother at the same time, but maybe I was fooled by the clothing and hairdo.

There is also a V mtdna project at the FTDNA website. There could be more people that are V12 in the project, and they might have a good genealogy.

Happy Hunting, Doug