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  • my test is in

    Haplogroup - L3e2a

  • #2
    I take it you weren't expecting that result?

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Sarmat View Post
      I take it you weren't expecting that result?

      no I was not, I was thinking I would have the typical northwestern European H,V,HV,U ect....

      Not really sure what to do with this

      Comment


      • #4
        Have you joined the L3 mtDNA Project?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by lgmayka View Post
          Have you joined the L3 mtDNA Project?
          I am not in any projects. I was in the Sicilian one but left. I will check it out

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by hazel_ion View Post
            no I was not, I was thinking I would have the typical northwestern European H,V,HV,U ect....

            Not really sure what to do with this
            There has been ongoing migration between Africa and Europe for thousands of years, and although the L haplogroups are usually of recent African origin, L is also found at low frequency in Europe. By researching the origins of your closest matches you might be able to estimate when your branch of L3e2a arrived in Europe. It could be recent or perhaps hundreds or thousands of years ago.

            The mtDNA test is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you are going to get.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by GST View Post
              There has been ongoing migration between Africa and Europe for thousands of years, and although the L haplogroups are usually of recent African origin, L is also found at low frequency in Europe. By researching the origins of your closest matches you might be able to estimate when your branch of L3e2a arrived in Europe. It could be recent or perhaps hundreds or thousands of years ago.

              The mtDNA test is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you are going to get.
              I have been reading like crazy and as I have a paper trail back to kent England in the 1500's with no African. I am guessing it goes way back. I did full Seq. and have only one match at HVRI and she is in England.

              I would love to know how this line for L3 to L3e2a made it this far. L3 is 70,000 years old and thought to be the one all other groups come from out of Africa.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by hazel_ion View Post
                I have been reading like crazy and as I have a paper trail back to kent England in the 1500's with no African. I am guessing it goes way back. I did full Seq. and have only one match at HVRI and she is in England.
                Comparing to more results will be helpful. If the L3 project administrators are active they might be able to say more about your close matches and whetehr you form part of a new subclade of L3e2a. If they are not active, feel free to join the L0 project, share the coding region results, and I can compare your results with others in GenBank. (The L3 project is better though, as they might have L3e2a samples that are not yet in GenBank).

                Gail

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by GST View Post
                  Comparing to more results will be helpful. If the L3 project administrators are active they might be able to say more about your close matches and whetehr you form part of a new subclade of L3e2a. If they are not active, feel free to join the L0 project, share the coding region results, and I can compare your results with others in GenBank. (The L3 project is better though, as they might have L3e2a samples that are not yet in GenBank).

                  Gail

                  thanks so much for your offer to help.
                  I will see if that group is active.

                  here is my coding regions

                  RSRS Values

                  Extra Mutations

                  309.1C

                  315.1C

                  G9196A

                  T16093C

                  C16257T

                  C16290a


                  Missing Mutations

                  C146T

                  C152T





                  HVR1 DIFFERENCES FROM RSRS
                  T16093C
                  A16129G
                  T16187C
                  C16189T
                  G16230A
                  C16257T
                  T16278C
                  C16290a
                  C16311T
                  C16320T



                  HVR2 DIFFERENCES FROM RSRS
                  C150T
                  A247G
                  309.1C
                  315.1C



                  CODING REGION DIFFERENCES FROM RSRS
                  A769G
                  A825t
                  A1018G
                  T2352C
                  A2758G
                  C2885T
                  T3594C
                  G4104A
                  T4312C
                  T4823C
                  G7146A
                  T7256C
                  A7521G
                  T8468C
                  T8655C
                  G9196A
                  T10664C
                  A10688G
                  C10810T
                  A10819G
                  C10915T
                  A11914G
                  G13276A
                  T13506C
                  T13650C
                  T14212C
                  G14869A
                  G14905A
                  G15301A

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Among the extras, the more useful ones are G9196A, C16257T, and C16290a. None of the L3e2a samples in GeBank have any of these three so your results seem to define a new subclade of L3e2a. The lack of close matches makes it difficult to say anything more specific about the origins of your maternal line. G9196A is found in several samples in L3e2b but appears to have occurred independently in that group.

                    Behar's age estimate for L3e2a is about 10,000 years so that would be the approximate date of your common maternal ancestor with others in L3e2a. This group is found from west to north Africa, frequently in Burkina Faso, but also in Tunisia, Egypt, Yoruba, Guinea-Bissau, and now, England.

                    Given that two of your extra mutations are in the HVR1 test, it is very likely that anyone who matches you in HVR1 is also in your new subclade of L3e2a. The fact that your match is also from England suggests that this group has been there for some time. Your match would need to test the full sequence to estimate how closely related they are to you. And you'll need more members of your subclade of L3e2a to better estimate when it left Africa.

                    Very interesting results.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by GST View Post
                      Among the extras, the more useful ones are G9196A, C16257T, and C16290a. None of the L3e2a samples in GeBank have any of these three so your results seem to define a new subclade of L3e2a. The lack of close matches makes it difficult to say anything more specific about the origins of your maternal line. G9196A is found in several samples in L3e2b but appears to have occurred independently in that group.

                      Behar's age estimate for L3e2a is about 10,000 years so that would be the approximate date of your common maternal ancestor with others in L3e2a. This group is found from west to north Africa, frequently in Burkina Faso, but also in Tunisia, Egypt, Yoruba, Guinea-Bissau, and now, England.

                      Given that two of your extra mutations are in the HVR1 test, it is very likely that anyone who matches you in HVR1 is also in your new subclade of L3e2a. The fact that your match is also from England suggests that this group has been there for some time. Your match would need to test the full sequence to estimate how closely related they are to you. And you'll need more members of your subclade of L3e2a to better estimate when it left Africa.

                      Very interesting results.
                      Thanks very interesting for sure.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by GST View Post
                        Among the extras, the more useful ones are G9196A, C16257T, and C16290a. None of the L3e2a samples in GeBank have any of these three so your results seem to define a new subclade of L3e2a. The lack of close matches makes it difficult to say anything more specific about the origins of your maternal line. G9196A is found in several samples in L3e2b but appears to have occurred independently in that group.

                        Behar's age estimate for L3e2a is about 10,000 years so that would be the approximate date of your common maternal ancestor with others in L3e2a. This group is found from west to north Africa, frequently in Burkina Faso, but also in Tunisia, Egypt, Yoruba, Guinea-Bissau, and now, England.

                        Given that two of your extra mutations are in the HVR1 test, it is very likely that anyone who matches you in HVR1 is also in your new subclade of L3e2a. The fact that your match is also from England suggests that this group has been there for some time. Your match would need to test the full sequence to estimate how closely related they are to you. And you'll need more members of your subclade of L3e2a to better estimate when it left Africa.

                        Very interesting results.

                        I also found this~

                        mtDNA L3e2* in a Sicilian-American

                        --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                        I have been asked by a Sicily Project member to explain the results, both yDNA and mtDNA, for her uncle.

                        I don't have much problem with the yDNA results. I feel fairly certain that he is E3b-M81 (based on a comparison with 2 SNP-tested Sicily Project members who are M81+), which would indicate possible deep ancestry from the Berbers of North Africa. This makes sense given how close North Africa is to Sicily and the fact that Berbers probably made up much of the Muslim population in Sicily during the Middle Ages. She also has a very definite family story that the ancestors were "Arabs" who converted to Christianity when the Normans took over around 1100. Of course, many people might confuse Berbers with Arabs.

                        His mtDNA results came in yesterday with these mutations from CRS:
                        HVR1 - 16223T, 16320T, 16325C, 16519C
                        HVR2 - 73G, 150T, 195C, 263G, 309.1C, 315.1C
                        FTDNA gives his haplogroup as L3e2*.

                        I understand that this is a sub-Saharan African mtDNA group. This is actually the second sub-Saharan African mtDNA group in the Sicily Project, out of 83 results. The other Sicily Project member is an L0a1. So, any sub-Saharan African mtDNA haplogroup in the project is very unusual, about 2%.

                        Given the probable Berber deep ancestry, I'm thinking it's possible that L3 or L3e may be found at low levels in the North African population. This may be due to very ancient migrations or perhaps the Muslim involvement in the black African slave trade in historic times.

                        Does anybody know whether I'm on the right track here? Or should I look for another explanation for finding L3e2* in someone of Sicilian ancestry?

                        Mike Maddi

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by GST View Post
                          Among the extras, the more useful ones are G9196A, C16257T, and C16290a. None of the L3e2a samples in GeBank have any of these three so your results seem to define a new subclade of L3e2a. The lack of close matches makes it difficult to say anything more specific about the origins of your maternal line. G9196A is found in several samples in L3e2b but appears to have occurred independently in that group.

                          Behar's age estimate for L3e2a is about 10,000 years so that would be the approximate date of your common maternal ancestor with others in L3e2a. This group is found from west to north Africa, frequently in Burkina Faso, but also in Tunisia, Egypt, Yoruba, Guinea-Bissau, and now, England.

                          Given that two of your extra mutations are in the HVR1 test, it is very likely that anyone who matches you in HVR1 is also in your new subclade of L3e2a. The fact that your match is also from England suggests that this group has been there for some time. Your match would need to test the full sequence to estimate how closely related they are to you. And you'll need more members of your subclade of L3e2a to better estimate when it left Africa.

                          Very interesting results.

                          so far I have learned

                          L3=70,000 years ago out of Africa
                          L3e=46,000
                          L3e2=37,500 but this one has a big +/- of 18,000 years
                          L3e2a=10,000 years and this is not for sure. Needs to be studied a lot more.

                          So I have a ton of questions like

                          Did this female leave of her own free will?
                          when did she leave?
                          Was she a slave forced to leave and when?
                          How is it that her mtDNA survived this long and went from a dark skinned African woman to a white skinned, hazel colored eyed woman today?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by hazel_ion View Post
                            when did she leave?

                            To determine when, it will be helpful to get more full sequence samples in your subclade of L3e2a. Perhaps your HVR match can upgrade in the next sale. If the English L3e2a members are quite diverse that would suggest an older origin. Also, as more people test there will be new samples in your group, but it's best to think of this as a long term project. It could take years to get enough samples to fully characterize your branch of the tree.

                            mtDNA does not affect physical appearance which is determined by autosomal DNA. After several generations the autosomal contribution from your original L3e2a maternal ancestor would be extremely small.

                            It would be interesting to see the full sequence of the Sicilian L3e2*.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by GST View Post
                              To determine when, it will be helpful to get more full sequence samples in your subclade of L3e2a. Perhaps your HVR match can upgrade in the next sale. If the English L3e2a members are quite diverse that would suggest an older origin. Also, as more people test there will be new samples in your group, but it's best to think of this as a long term project. It could take years to get enough samples to fully characterize your branch of the tree.

                              mtDNA does not affect physical appearance which is determined by autosomal DNA. After several generations the autosomal contribution from your original L3e2a maternal ancestor would be extremely small.

                              It would be interesting to see the full sequence of the Sicilian L3e2*.
                              I agree there is not quick answer here and I will continue to watch what happens with this group.
                              I yes appearance has nothing to do with mtDNA as other markers mutated to create pigments,eye color,hair color.

                              Comment

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