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  • Matches to a different surname

    My project, Vines, has 4 tests matched 25/25 on participants descended from ancestors in Wiltshire England. We haven't connected them together with paper to a common ancestor yet but well on the way. We haven't seen a connection from Wiltshire to anyone in US yet though I have no doubt we will.

    FTDNA also inform us of a match with a different surname Mingia in Nth Carolina. Of course I thought this was coincidental and unrelated but I thought it wise to make some sort of check. Using the US 1880 census I searched Nth Carolina for both names and was surprised to find a substantial number of both, with a lot shown as black, so it appears both names were probably large plantation owners. Going further I found a map of the counties and coloured those with the two names. I was then surprised to see that the county Halifax where the pedigree line of the Mingia had come from is adjacent to Martin and Edgecombe where there were a lot of Vines. It certainly appears to me now that this Mingia is descended from a Vines, though there is no obvious connection in that families paperwork, though there looks like room for a connection in the early days. Children of a young Vines widow or single mother brought into a Mingia marriage would be one way it could have happened.
    Now I guess this Mingia test was a 12 marker (Pardon me for not checking) I have attached the graphic of the counties but being an Australian I have no idea of scale or topography so it could be a random match I suppose. Is it worthwhile getting the test extended to 25 markers on this evidence. Joanne Burcher who had her brother Sam Mingia tested doesn't know what to think and I am as interested as her to find the truth of this problem. As you may guess the documents of a developing frontier area in the time of say Revolution to 1850 leave gaps in detail.

    To add spice to all this Joe Vines from Arkansas tested a long way off our DNA, but thought his ancestor was hanged for openly supporting the rebel cause in 1770s and his widow married a Vines. In Nth Carolina! So near and yet so far! What say you guys with local knowledge.
    Fred Vines

  • #2
    Max
    How do you open the attachment? Did it go?
    Hell if anything can go wrong I'll find it!
    Fred

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    • #3
      Herewith the map of Nth Carolina counties showing propinquity of Vines (Edgecombe county) and Mingias (Halifax County)
      C:\Documents and Settings\User1\My Documents\GENEALOGY\VINES\WILTS INDEXes\Nth Carolina\NCcounties.gif

      Nth Carolina Counties

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Fred Vines
        Herewith the map of Nth Carolina counties showing propinquity of Vines (Edgecombe county) and Mingias (Halifax County)
        C:\Documents and Settings\User1\My Documents\GENEALOGY\VINES\WILTS INDEXes\Nth Carolina\NCcounties.gif

        Nth Carolina Counties
        Hi Fred,
        You did not upload it. You just copied and pasted the link from your hard drive. I am attaching our logo so that ya'll can see how it looks in the message when it has an attachment to it.
        You have to go to the attachment box, two down below the box where you are typing your message. It says "Attach file" and "Browse". Click on "Browse", look for the file in your computer, click on it, and that's it . The name of the image should appear in the "Browse" box. Then just submit your reply.
        Attached Files
        Max Blankfeld
        Vice-President and COO @ Family Tree DNA
        A Gene by Gene Company

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        • #5
          Once again!
          Fred
          Attached Files

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          • #6
            With reference to the first message of this thread:
            Joanne Burcher had 12 marker test done on her brother Sam Mingia, both of Nth Carolina, and the result is a match with me. Although I initially agreed with FTDNA's note that unlike surnames with 12/12 matches are probably not related, Jo and I are now planning extension of her test to 25 marker. We have the thought that proximity of the Mingia (Minga, Mingay etc) and Vines names in N.C. is suspiciously indicative of an event that was kept secret in part of her family genealogy, perhaps 150 to 200 years ago.
            Her first test was just a one off private test. I am now encouraging her to start a family surname project with the hope of gaining many Mingia participants and pinning down the generation in which the irregular event occurred.
            Can this test extension be regarded as the start of a surname project, with the consequent cost reductions?
            We both find this matter very exciting, a stroke of luck out of the blue. From my point of view it is the first prospective proof of Vines migration to the New World from Wiltshire. Richard Vines is known to have been a prominent settler in Maine in the early 1600s, later moving to Barbados and his descendants may well have moved later to the mainland, but other Vines immigrants are believed to have crossed the Atlantic before the Revolution.

            The main points of this message?
            1) What constitutes the start of a surname project, what are the conditions?
            2) A plug for some investigation of all different surname matches, don't dismiss them out of hand, especially in frontier areas.

            Fred Vines

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            • #7
              Fred, your situation sounds like one we had in our project. One man, who has worked for many years on various lines in Kentucky to find a connection with his family, was probably the most excited early participant. He was disappointed to find his results were miles away any other line in the project-- but when we turned off the "match within surname" indicator he was excited all over again as he was a 12/12 match with a man with a surname that married into one of our project's lines. Both men's research brick-walled with men born around 1820, and both immediately sent off for the upgrade to 25 markers. When the results came in, he was disappointed again. Of the 13 additional markers, they mismatched on 6 of them.

              Both are glad though they upgraded to check out the possibility that some inter-line hanky-panky wasn't the reason for their brick walls. . .

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