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  • My Lineage

    I participated in The Genographic Project
    the results show that I belong to haplogroup O
    but not O1 O2 O3
    does that mean I belong to a rare type of O
    could some of you tell me about
    the information and distribution of my lineage

    DYS393: 12 DYS439: 12 DYS388: 12 DYS385a: 12
    DYS19: 15 DYS389-1: 12 DYS390: 24 DYS385b: 17
    DYS391: 10 DYS389-2: 16 DYS426: 11 DYS392: 12

  • #2
    That seems strange, I've never heard of O*, but I'd need to check some papers. If you are from Finland (as your name suggest), it seems more likely that you are N (a brother clade). There exist also a rare NO clade, but I don't think it is found in Europe. Have you tried checking on www.ysearch.org? You can compare yourself to many people. If your matches belong to, say, N, then this may be an indication.

    cacio

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    • #3
      Have you uploaded your results to FTDNA? It's possible that the GP did a backbone SNP test. That's what happened to me with my first GP test - they told me I was just "J", but immediately upon uploading, I found out I was confirmed J1.

      Comment


      • #4
        thank you both for the answers

        forgot to tell you about my background
        Finn is just my English name
        I'm from Taiwan and speak Chinese languages

        according to some papers
        haplogroup O* can be detected at a low frequency
        among populations of Central Asia and East Asia

        some people participating in the GP got their results
        indicating they're O3 because they've got marker M122

        my results show that I've got marker M175
        but not any of the later mutations
        that define the major subclades O1, O2, and O3

        my ysearch ID is RQBKE and AJG7B
        there's no full matches and most of them are O* and O3

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        • #5
          just found a paper when googling O*
          http://li-hui.net/Documents/A30.PDF

          Comment


          • #6
            The Genographic Project only looks at the backbone haplogroup and does not do deep-clade testing. There is no question about that. The only caveat here is that if GP considers O1, O2 or O3 to be backbone haplogroups, then you might have been tested for them. For instance, they always break down R into R1a and R1b since those groups are so huge and knowing that someone is only 'R' wouldn't be very helpful to them. However, GP does not test for any subclades below R1a or R1b -- a deep-clade test would be needed for that.

            So finn, you would need to find out if GP does test for O1, O2 or O3 to determine if you are O* or if you are O and haven't been tested for O1, O2 or O3 yet.

            Regarding cacio's comment that you could be N... in addition to the fact that you just explained that you are not Finnish, I doubt GP would make that kind of mistake. GP tries to predict the haplogroup first. If the prediction is confident, then they'll report the predicted haplogroup. However, if the prediction is not confident, then they automatically do a backbone SNP test to determine/confirm the haplogroup. GP has a strict policy on what confidence level they will accept for predictions, so mistakes are very rare.

            Finn, Genographic provides only a high-level view of your ancestry. For more detailed information and the opportunity to do additional testing, create a free account at Family Tree DNA (go to the very bottom of your GP results page, where it says "What else can I do with my results?"). Once you have an FTDNA account, you'll be able to see if you have any matches in their database, will be able to see if your O is predicted or SNP-tested, and if they offer an O deep-clade test, you'll be able to order it. You'll also be able to order more markers, if you wish.
            Last edited by efgen; 3 October 2008, 10:52 AM.

            Comment


            • #7
              thank you, efgen

              I think the GP considers
              O1, O2, and O3 to be backbone haplogroups

              atlas of human journey shows them
              https://www3.nationalgeographic.com/...hic/atlas.html

              some of my friends are O3 in the results
              but apparently the GP doesn't display any subclades below O1, O2, and O3

              before my results came out
              the GP said they couldn't clearly indicate my haplogroup
              and a few days later
              the results came out and indicated that I belong to O-M175

              I have a free account in FTDNA
              and they show my O-M175 is "predicted"

              my closest matches are mostly
              O, O3, O3a3c, O3a4, J2, J2b, but again no full matches in the database

              Dual origins of the Japanese
              http://www.springerlink.com/content/...5/fulltext.pdf
              Last edited by finn1031; 3 October 2008, 12:55 PM.

              Comment


              • #8
                This page here states that if they cannot predict the haplogroup, they will run the backbone test:
                http://www.familytreedna.com/SNP_assurance.html

                but, as efgen was saying, the backbone test only tests for O, not for subgroups of O. Were you explicitly told that you were tested for O1-O3 and found negative? If not, perhaps it's best to ask them explicitly.

                Or perhaps you've taken the deep clade test:
                http://www.familytreedna.com/deepclade.html

                this one does test for O subgroups.

                Perhaps some people appear as O3 with a basic test because their STR places them there with high probability. But O3 is a very old group, so there's a lot of variability in STRs.

                (As you've seen from the sources you cite, O* seems to be extremely rare, and one wonders whether the fractions of percent found in the papers may not be instead mistakes in the test.)

                cacio

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by finn1031
                  before my results came out
                  the GP said they couldn't clearly indicate my haplogroup
                  and a few days later
                  the results came out and indicated that I belong to O-M175

                  I have a free account in FTDNA
                  and they show my O-M175 is "predicted"
                  Hmm, sounds like the lab did do a SNP test for your GP kit, but then I wonder why your FTDNA account shows only the prediction. I would recommend emailing FTDNA ([email protected]) to find out for certain if you were SNP-tested or not, and if so, which SNPs were tested and why isn't your FTDNA account showing the SNP results. No use in speculating further when you can just ask

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by efgen
                    Hmm, sounds like the lab did do a SNP test for your GP kit, but then I wonder why your FTDNA account shows only the prediction. I would recommend emailing FTDNA ([email protected]) to find out for certain if you were SNP-tested or not, and if so, which SNPs were tested and why isn't your FTDNA account showing the SNP results. No use in speculating further when you can just ask
                    http://www.isogg.org/geno.htm
                    https://www3.nationalgeographic.com/...rticipate.html

                    the GP said "This is a 12-marker test. Additional testing such as a SNP test may be run on a Y-chromosome sample if analysis of the 12 STR values does not conclusively indicate a Haplogroup assignment."

                    several days before I got my results I logged in my GP account and saw "Your sample has completed the DNA analysis phase of testing. However, during quality control your initial results failed to clearly indicate your haplogroup. We must perform additional testing to accurately determine your deep ancestral lineage. This is not uncommon, but will delay the posting of your results by two to three weeks. We appreciate your patience. Please also note that this delay is a sign of the Project's success in increasing the diversity of samples in our database. If we find that there is a problem at any point during the processing of your sample, you will receive an updated message when you log in to check your status." yes, I think I'll just ask them to figure it out. thanks.
                    Last edited by finn1031; 3 October 2008, 04:42 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      This is exactly what just happened to my second cousin's sample, who tested for my great-grandfather's haplogroup - my father's maternal yDNA below. The GP did enough SNP testing to confirm the haplogroup, but I've just ordered the deep clade from FTDNA.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hi, I'm back

                        I've ordered the Deep Clade Test by FTDNA

                        the expected date of results is July 8th

                        can anyone of you make a prediction on my upcoming deep clade results??

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by finn1031 View Post
                          Hi, I'm back

                          I've ordered the Deep Clade Test by FTDNA

                          the expected date of results is July 8th

                          can anyone of you make a prediction on my upcoming deep clade results??
                          you can use Athey's predictor here:
                          http://www.hprg.com/hapest5/hapest5b/hapest5.htm

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by knight View Post
                            you can use Athey's predictor here:
                            http://www.hprg.com/hapest5/hapest5b/hapest5.htm
                            thanks for the reply, knight.
                            but Athey's predictor does not work on haplogroup O.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Probably O1 or O1a*.

                              Let's see what it actually comes up. Keep us posted!

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