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Natufians haplogroup J2?

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  • #16
    P.S. Nebel was one of the experts who suggested that J2 emerged out of J1.

    I guess my view is that since the Neolithic Period there have been a number of migrations of J1 and J2. Sometimes the migratory paths have overlapped although perhaps not at the same time. At other times the migratory paths have been distinct.
    Last edited by josh w.; 10 January 2007, 07:32 PM.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by josh w.
      From what I have read (e.g. Stephen Oppenheimer), J began near the Zagros mountains in eastern Iraq. There is no accepted theory of the relationship between J1 and J2. DiGiacomo suggested that J1 arose out of J2, but others theorized the opposite-- that J2 arose out of J1. If either of these views are correct there would have been a time when J1 and J2 followed similar paths. Of course if J1 and J2 developed independently they might not follow similar paths. It is the case that J2 followed a northerly path and J1 followed a more southerly one. However the paths were not that far apart as evidenced by the Middle Eastern countries were both are present to a significant degree.

      Alright Josh I see you view and it is an interesting one. J1 did not come from J2 though and J2 did not come from J1 either. They each come from J which is defined by the M304 SNP or 12f2.1 J2 as I am sure you know is defined by M172 and J1 by M267. The most recent common ancestor of J2 and J1 is M304. Unless there is some SNP that has not been discovered yet then neither one came from the other.



      Y-DNA: J2a*

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      • #18
        Understand your point about SNPs and I don't have alternative explanation regarding SNPS. Nebel suggested that the split from J1 to J2 was reflected in a T to G transversion but most of his comments were about STRs. DiGiacomo also focused on STRs.
        Last edited by josh w.; 11 January 2007, 06:38 PM.

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        • #19
          Haplogroup IJ

          Josh

          Have you taken the SNP test for haplogroup IJ which is offered by Ethnoancestry as S22?

          Norman

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          • #20
            Originally posted by genny
            Josh

            Have you taken the SNP test for haplogroup IJ which is offered by Ethnoancestry as S22?

            Norman

            I have taken that test and I am of course S22+.



            Y-DNA: J2a*

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            • #21
              Sorry, I have not been SNP'd yet. This month will be taking FTDNA's test. Since I think I am J2a*, I will look further if anything shows up.

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              • #22
                J2 migrations -- continued

                I'm reminded that Sengupta concluded that J2b migrated to India even before the Neolithic Period. He also concluded that we don't yet have a good picture of the various migrations of J. With respect to J2b, he also challenged the J2= Mediterranian view by noting the diversity of that subclade was greater in southwestern Asia than in Turkey.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by josh w.
                  I'm reminded that Sengupta concluded that J2b migrated to India even before the Neolithic Period. He also concluded that we don't yet have a good picture of the various migrations of J. With respect to J2b, he also challenged the J2= Mediterranian view by noting the diversity of that subclade was greater in southwestern Asia than in Turkey.


                  Yes I have read that paper before and it is a good one. I found it very interesting how he mentions that some J2 may have actually migrated to India before the Neolithic.



                  Y-DNA: J2a*

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