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Italian R1b1 - The Central Italian Refugium

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  • #31
    Originally posted by sicily
    I have received the results of my maternal dna through the genographic project, my results 16224C,16311C,16519C are all rapresenting a lineage found in Ashkenazi jews.
    Your results are actually more consistent with a mostly-Gentile variety of mtDNA haplogroup K. In fact, you match my Aunt Stefania of southern Poland! (Actually, her daughter's son was the one tested.)

    Many FTDNA customers turn off matching on HVR1 only, because it results in so many uselessly distant "matches." But you should still see such matches listed by ancestry on your mtDNA Ancestral Origins tab.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by cacio
      There is also a mtdna K group in FTDNA, though I don't know the details, someone else will tell you.
      Bill Hurst runs the mtDNA Haplogroup K Project, and you should certainly join.

      http://www.familytreedna.com/public/mtDNA_K/

      I also encourage you to join the geographic projects associated with Siciliy and Italy.

      http://www.familytreedna.com/public/Sicily/
      http://www.familytreedna.com/public/Italy/

      K is not particularly common in Italy, but there is at least one other member in the Italy DNA Project with the same HVR1 results and several in the Sicily Project.

      Once you've joined at least one project, you should give some thought to upgrading your results to include HVR2. That might give you more insight into your haplogroup and will refine your matches at mitosearch.org and at smgf.org.

      Your HVR1 results occur in each of the major subclades of K (K1a, K1b, K1c, and K2a), and the HVR2 results might help sort out the difference.

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      • #33
        Lombard influences

        I agree with David Faux: The Lombard influence is of particular interest. Even to the present day, a Siculo-Gallic dialect exists in the areas where the Lombard colonies were the strongest, namely Novara, Nicosia, Sperlinga, Aidone and Piazza Armerina. The Siculo-Gallic dialect did not survive in other major Lombard colonies, such as Randazzo, Bronte and PaternĂ² (although they did influence the local sicilian vernacular).

        David Faux of Ethnoancestry believes that much of the R1b in Italy is due to the settlement there by the Lombards. And then there's the short period of rule by Frederick Hohenstaufen and his father and sons, which would be more potential German genetic input in Randazzo (The 'Hohenstaufen' Castle).

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Randazzo

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Carcere_randazzo.jpg

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        • #34
          The Lombards

          The Lombards (or Longobards) were a Germanic tribe whose origins were fabled to have been in the barbarian realm of Scandinavia. After centuries of obscurity during the long period of Roman domination in Europe, the Lombards began a concerted migration southeastwards to conquer new lands in southern Europe. By the sixth century the Lombards had emerged as new and powerful protagonists in the former heartland of the Empire. Pushing across the Danube to occupy Hungary (Pannonia) in the 520s, the Lombards subsequently invaded Italy in 568-569. Here they established a strongly militarized kingdom based on the fertile north Italian plains, but also extending into central and southern Italy. The northern kingdom endured for more than two centuries, before its conquest by Charlemagne; and even after this defeat, a Lombard state continued to exist in southern Italy until the eleventh century.

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          • #35
            Originally posted by johnraciti
            David Faux of Ethnoancestry believes that much of the R1b in Italy is due to the settlement there by the Lombards. And then there's the short period of rule by Frederick Hohenstaufen and his father and sons, which would be more potential German genetic input in Randazzo (The 'Hohenstaufen' Castle).
            Hogwash. R1b is just too common and too widespread in Italy to be attributed only to the Germanics.

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