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Etruscan DNA?

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  • Etruscan
    replied
    Francesco--

    here is a bit of intriguing info, at least to me. It is thought that the descendents of the victims of the Vesuvius volcanic catastrophe had some sort of genetic anomaly, which was, get this----missing teeth!! Many of them have missing adult teeth, molars I believe I read. I have 4 missing teeth (not front teeth!!! ) and they are molars.

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  • F.E.C.
    replied
    Originally posted by Etruscan
    Cacio, thanks for posting. Actually, my mother's father is from around the Vesuvius region. So I guess Etruscan would apply here?
    I think it would. Victor provided this interesting link: http://web.unife.it/progetti/genetic...s/AJHG2004.pdf

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  • Etruscan
    replied
    Cacio, thanks for posting. Actually, my mother's father is from around the Vesuvius region. So I guess Etruscan would apply here?

    I am aware that name changes occured when immigrants came over here. Actually, my father's father very Italian last name was Americanized when he immigrated here. I am still trying to find out where he came through. Seems Ellis Island records are coming up blank. I have limited time on the computer so I hope I can eventually figure this all out. My hunch is that my grandmother's maiden name TERAMO was with her before she came to this country, because, like you said, it is in existence but not common. I think I told Francesco in a private message that she looked American Indian. However I never saw her in person because I born very late compared to rest of my cousins and brothers and sisters, and she had an untimely death.

    Thanks for all the help.

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  • F.E.C.
    replied
    Originally posted by Etruscan
    Sorry if I am initiating a tangent here, but have any of you heard of the Essenes? I believe my ancestors are descendents of them. I have various reasons for believing this but it would take an eternity to explain. Just thought I would throw this info out to anyone who has knowledge of them. Ciao and grazie!
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essenes

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  • cacio
    replied
    Ciao Etruscan.

    Nice nickname. Although - who knows where the Etruscans came from. Actually, the regions you mentioned were never inhabited by Etruscans. Before the Romans, they were inhabited by Italic people, such as the Oscans and the Samnites, who spoke languages closely related to Latin (and so may be have common origins). The Etruscans lived between Rome and Florence.
    Of course they may have been the same people, simply some spoke a different language. (This is where genetic analysis may help, although so far I don't think it has solved the problem).

    You mentioned a couple of family names. You can check the distribution of current family names in Italy (from phonebooks) at the following website:
    http://gens.labo.net/
    (type the 'cognome'=surname you're looking for). Antonelli comes from Antonio (=Tony), so it is not typical of one particular region, and most likely comprises different, unrelated families. Teramo as a family name does exist, but it doesn't seem very common, so as you mention one possibility is that the immigration wrote the city of origin as a name. I think it often happened that when the immigration didn't understand or didn't like the names, they changed them and wrote something else.

    cacio

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  • Etruscan
    replied
    The Essenes were a prayerful religious sect around the time of Christ. St. John the Baptist is believed to be a former Essene. They lived a life of strict rules....like many monks have lived over the centuries.

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  • F.E.C.
    replied
    Maybe. I don't know if we mean the same people...they're Jews, right?

    In that case maybe a Y-DNA test could help you make the whole picture clearer.

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  • Etruscan
    replied
    Sorry if I am initiating a tangent here, but have any of you heard of the Essenes? I believe my ancestors are descendents of them. I have various reasons for believing this but it would take an eternity to explain. Just thought I would throw this info out to anyone who has knowledge of them. Ciao and grazie!

    Leave a comment:


  • Etruscan
    replied
    Yes, Francesco! It is Francavilla Al Mare! Would you be able to tell me your surname and that of your mother's? You could always send me a private message if you prefer. Let me know, thank you.

    I find it so interesting that Haplogroup H is so diverse. I have done searches on this group but i think I need more info, perhaps a more refined test....?

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  • F.E.C.
    replied
    Originally posted by Etruscan
    Now here is what is interesting. My grandfather (my dad's father) is an immigrant from Abruzzi the town of Francavilla) and we assumed that he came thru Ellis Island, because my dad does not remember. However, when I check for his name, we cannot find any records. Which means he could have come through Boston. And you mention Boston, MA and the like. Please tell me more!!!! Grazie!!!
    Ciao Etruscan,
    If you mean Francavilla al Mare, that's where my grandmother is from too

    Francesco

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  • Etruscan
    replied
    Jim, could you please tell me more about these projects...where can I read about them?

    The only reason I know my great-great grandmother's last name (on dad's side) is because I looked on the Manifest list for Ellis Island for my Father's mother, her surname was Teramo. My grandmother listed her grandmother's name as a relative living back in Italy. Now Teramo is a town in Abruzzi...I am wondering if they changed her name? I do not know but it seems highly unlikely to me.

    Now here is what is interesting. My grandfather (my dad's father) is an immigrant from Abruzzi the town of Francavilla) and we assumed that he came thru Ellis Island, because my dad does not remember. However, when I check for his name, we cannot find any records. Which means he could have come through Boston. And you mention Boston, MA and the like. Please tell me more!!!! Grazie!!!

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  • Jim Denning
    replied
    Originally posted by Etruscan
    I am laughing because I just saw this thread and here I am with a screen name of Etruscan! I picked that name because as far as we know on my mother's side all the back into the mid 1800's, all of the females were from Italy. However their appearances seem to suggest otherwise. They were all fair, blondes or red hair and green/blue eyes. I am very dark, dark skin, dark hair and eyes, like my father. His family is traced to Italy also, to the EARLY 1800's... Abruzzi, to be exact, which is on the Adriatic. What is very interesting is that my mother's maternal origin is not far from my father's, the town my grandmother is from (on mother's side) is called Foggia. Here are two very different-looking family lines, but their towns of origin close to one another. I was born late 1960's. We know that my father's great-grandmother's last name was Antonelli. I have not done a paternal test yet, I have done the MTDNA with National Geographic, and I am haplogroup H with CRS difference of 16519C. I wondering which step to take next, or which test to take for more info. Sorry if I "butted" in here!
    abruzzi ,antonelli any relation to chelsea or brighton ma. or frosinone province italy san danto- alvito in specific

    also is 519c hrv1 or both

    if any of those locations seem correct i run the frosinone project and the brighton/newton project and those names are in both i believe

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  • Etruscan
    replied
    I am laughing because I just saw this thread and here I am with a screen name of Etruscan! I picked that name because as far as we know on my mother's side all the back into the mid 1800's, all of the females were from Italy. However their appearances seem to suggest otherwise. They were all fair, blondes or red hair and green/blue eyes. I am very dark, dark skin, dark hair and eyes, like my father. His family is traced to Italy also, to the EARLY 1800's... Abruzzi, to be exact, which is on the Adriatic. What is very interesting is that my mother's maternal origin is not far from my father's, the town my grandmother is from (on mother's side) is called Foggia. Here are two very different-looking family lines, but their towns of origin close to one another. I was born late 1960's. We know that my father's great-grandmother's last name was Antonelli. I have not done a paternal test yet, I have done the MTDNA with National Geographic, and I am haplogroup H with CRS difference of 16519C. I wondering which step to take next, or which test to take for more info. Sorry if I "butted" in here!

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  • F.E.C.
    replied
    Said that an Italian can be blond and tall even without German ancestors, I agree with you when you say that Tuscany is the most "open" to foreign influence among the central Italian regions, but think to Umbria (where my granfather came from), Latium's countryside, Marche's Appennine, or even to Abruzzo's mountains, although in the last case I'm not talking about a Pope's "property" (here I was witness of heaten traditions become christian in small villages on rocks: who can have possibly got there even in 2000 years?)
    To some extent I can say that in these areas the Roman empire continued with no hiatus, through the Pope's authority, until the late XIX century.

    In reference to haplos, I meant that yeah...you're haplogroup L and I presume you have an Italian surname so that's fine by me...but take a look on the FTDNA Italy project page and you'll understand what I am talking about. I only ask to myself how can a couple of clearly non Italian surnames with clearly non Italian haplogroups have a paternal line from Italy...

    ciao Cacio

    Francesco

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  • cacio
    replied
    This seems a good point historically, at least for most of Tuscany and Central Italy. And most of the population was probably scattered anyway in small villages in the hills or the mountains, not in the depopulated cities. Although, as usual, it would be nice to have some direct genetic evidence.

    My guess though is that some parts of Northern Tuscany are more varied. I don't believe too much in these stats, but for instance the average height in the province of Lucca is the second or so in Italy, as is the percentage of blondes (I think this data comes from some old - XIX century stats for military conscripts, although I don't have the exact source). May be that's a sign of Germanic admixture (the Lombards had a duchy in Lucca, after all). And in the northwest of Tuscany several people have passed: Ligurians, Romans, Byzantines, Lombards etc.

    Regarding strange haplos, I must say I have one - I belong to Y-haplogroup L, although the family has been living at least since the XVIII century in the Massa area (hence my interest in Tuscany). (Mtdna is U1a, which is common in the Arabic world - but not unknown in the rest of the Mediterranean and Europe.)

    cacio

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