Mistake in results

[kesh]

Is it possible the results from the Genographic Project be incorrect or mixed up with someone else?

[Victor]

Is it possible the results from the Genographic Project be incorrect or mixed up with someone else?

Everything is possible but highly unlikeky. What makes you ask this question?

[kesh]

See my earlier question "who am I". My haplogroup is I (m170) which places an ancestor of mine near the Balkans. This group also stopped at the Balkans. My father and grandfather lived in a little village in Uttar Pradesh in north east India. Looking at a world map, you can see how so distant the 2 places are. One explanation may be my ancestor must have travelled as a solder or a slave/servant. I don't know much about history of the region but it seems unlikely that that ancestor of mine travelled through Pakistan, most of north India to arrive at NE India. It just does not add up.

And thank you for responding.

[josh w.]

Kesh, there are a number of possibilities. First of all your haplogroup may be incorrect. Your results were based on STRs rather than SNPs. STR results are correlated with SNP results but the correlation is not perfect. Haplogroup membership is defined by SNPs and you would need a SNP test to get the definitive answer.

Secondly it is quite possible that you are an I. Recent family history is not very informative about haplogroup membership (My parents were from eastern Europe but my haplogroup J matches are spread from England to western China). The most likely way for an I to get to eastern India is by trade route, e.g. southern extensions of the Silk Road. Other possibilites include religious or military expansion to western India and internal migration within India.

[josh w.]

P.S. Although haplogroup I is thought of as "European", it actually started out in the Near East.

[derinos]

derinos

"Started out" and "originated" keep appearing in our discussions.
To get really basic, it should be appreciated they are not absolute terms, but occasions on the "Great River" of Dawkins, as it branches and sometimes recurves to run alongside itself, as in the refugial episodes, with their sub-originations and re-mixes.

If you accept the "Out of Africa" concept, ALL the existing extra-African haplogroups, from their matri- and patriline predecessor Hg's onwards, geographically "originated" in the walkway between Africa and Eurasia, on the "Near East" land bridge, which varied in dryness depending on the current state of the ice-caps.
Where they went afterwards, and when, is what we enjoyably riddle in these threads.
..... (There ARE some "Africa to wherever" sea-travel possibilities being raised occasionally. )

[josh w.]

Derinos, point well taken. I sometimes wish that the nomenclature project had listed all Ydna and Mtdna haplogroups as subclades of African haplogroups rather than creating the misleading impression that there are independent non-African clades.

[R1a_M17_India]

See my earlier question "who am I". My haplogroup is I (m170) which places an ancestor of mine near the Balkans. This group also stopped at the Balkans. My father and grandfather lived in a little village in Uttar Pradesh in north east India. Looking at a world map, you can see how so distant the 2 places are. One explanation may be my ancestor must have travelled as a solder or a slave/servant. I don't know much about history of the region but it seems unlikely that that ancestor of mine travelled through Pakistan, most of north India to arrive at NE India. It just does not add up.

And thank you for responding.

Kesh,
You should not visualize one single person traveling from the Balkans (or the Near East or wherever) to Uttar Pradesh in his lifetime. Some 'I' may have reached the Middle East, and then a few of their descendants travelled further East etc. Trade or War is the best way how 'I' reached India.

Remember that none of our ancestors migrated to India in one single journey, but it was more of gradual movements with each generation moving further and further.

Perhaps you should visualize your 'I' ancestor as more of a middle eastern person rather than of Balkan origin. Middle Easterners invaded India many times throughout the Muslim history and pillaged. Babur and his accompanying group were from Turkey and Persia.

Affected Hindus moved from modern day Pakistan into deeper India due to the frequent invasions from the Middle East. Thats what seems most likely - some 'I' moving into Uttar Pradesh in a gradual wave and not 1 single person.

[cacio]

dear kesh,

I was browsing for posts about India and Pakistan and found yours.
I checked on a recent article about Y chromosome in India and Pakistan
by Sengupta et al., Polarity and Temporality of High Resolution
Y-chromosome distributions in India (you should find it if you do a Google
search), which looks at >700 people from India and >150 from Pakistan.
They do not find any single haplogroup-I person in India (!)
and only one in Pakistan. The I group is really only present in Europe.
So your result is really interesting.
I was wondering if your result was determined only by STRs or if they looked also at SNP. If you don't know, you should send them an email and ask them.
The point is, there aren't very many Indians who do these tests, and plenty
of Europeans, so your STR may happen to match some group I people, while
you belong to another group, as some previous post suggested. It's always
worth verifying.

Btw, in a way, my case is somewhat specular, I am Italian but my
haplogroup (verified by SNP) is haplogroup L, which is common only in
India and Pakistan. I still wonder which types of migrations brough L people
to Italy.

cacio

[Hetware]

This is my guess as to how your I ancestor may have found his way to India:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Indo-Greek+Kingdom&btnG=Google+Search

I is common in Nordic populations as well. It's not well known to most people, but the Norsemen (sometimes called Vikings, but not all of them were pirates) traveled to the Caspian and beyond. So that is another possibility. There were also Englishmen in India over the years.