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  • Dirty little secrets.....

    I am oldest child of Florabelle Parent of Somerset, Wisconsin. I was born 21 May 1953 in St. Paul, Mn. Ten yrs ago I was informed by an aunt that "Red" was not my biological father. My mother married him a couple months before I was born. His name is on my birth certificate. I had suspected this since I was a teenager. I have 4 younger siblings. 1/2 siblings. I have found out since that EVERYONE knew. Except me. "Red" was a monster to me all my life. I always wondered what was wrong with me. My Aunt Clara telling me the truth was the best thing that anyone ever did for me. Everything fell into place! I understood how I came to be a "living abortion" within that family. A year ago, I came upon an article about DNA testing for genealogy. Ever since I have been searching. My Y-dna test confirmed that I have almost exclusively scandinavian paternity. I toof FF test and came up with about a dozen matches. Nothing close on paternal side, except one 2nd cousin match which appears to be maternal but cannot find any paper trail at all. Y-dna matches point to a few surnames.....Anderson, Peterson, Jakobsen, Jussila. I am still learning the art and science of all of this. It is extremely interesting. Have to be careful to keep it from becoming obsession. Allen Appleby

  • #2
    Originally posted by AllenUnknown View Post
    A year ago, I came upon an article about DNA testing for genealogy. Ever since I have been searching.
    I hope you find what you are looking for. Your situation strikes me as having parallels with adoptees. There are quite a few people on this forum with knowledge of the various searching avenues open to adoptees so maybe you can get some good tips from them.

    Comment


    • #3
      I'm one of those adoptees. I'm what is known as LDA (late discovery adoptee) who found out at age 31 that I was adopted. Although I was treated well by my adoptive family, I know what you mean by "everyone else knew" and the pieces falling into place after the truth comes out.

      I'm not that familiar with Y testing (being female) but I have helped someone tracing Finnish roots. The change to surnames (as we know them) was relatively recent. Many Scandinavian families kept the patronymic naming conventions (Kristerson, Kristersdotter) well into the 19th century. That is why you are seeing AnderSON and PeterSON and JakobSON. Jussila is likely the name of the farm/town/region your paternal line lived in. There is a Jussila Sysma in Finland.

      We also have a Yahoo!Group for adoptees and anyone who is searching for close relatives with little or no info: AdoptionDNA

      There are extensive Finnish church records online but right now I think the time period is too far removed from where your knowledge is. I just wanted to let you know they are there and I know how to use them (as does one of my adoptee friends whose heritage it is).

      Let me know if I can be of any help.

      Gaye
      Last edited by GayeSherman; 3 April 2011, 06:57 PM. Reason: cut off

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      • #4
        Being that your mother married "Red" a few months before you were born, Im taking it Red just signed your birth certificate as your legal father. You were not adopted, correct?

        If this is the case, I hope you did a 67 Y-DNA marker. Your direct father line if they are out there somewhere would have to match you very close to 67 marker

        Family Finder may help if you ever find a close match that might be willing to Y DNA test if they haven't. You might also want to test with 23andme since they have some different markers than Family Finder.

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        • #5
          No 23andMe does not use more markers to test with. RF tests with more but it pars them down to make itself compatible with its v1 and v2 tests so in the end it doesn't use more markers than FTDNA FF. FTDNA actually uses more markers to test with than RF when its all said and done.

          Unless you have some close 37 yDNA marker matches there is no reason to immediately upgrade to 67 yDNA markers. If you don't see close matches with 37 yDNA markers you won't see any closer ones with 67 and besides that less people have tested 67 than they have 37 so there is a higher chance the other parties haven't even upgraded to 67 either. Wait for a close match or extra money before upgrading 37 yDNA to 67 yDNA as it won't improve results if you don't already have them now.

          MD.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Yaffa View Post
            Being that your mother married "Red" a few months before you were born, Im taking it Red just signed your birth certificate as your legal father. You were not adopted, correct?
            I read Allen's story as not adopted, but with a similar problem. Adoptees use various avenues of research outside of DNA testing in their search for biological parents(s), and I'm hoping that those avenues may also be useful to Allen.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by gtc View Post
              I read Allen's story as not adopted, but with a similar problem. Adoptees use various avenues of research outside of DNA testing in their search for biological parents(s), and I'm hoping that those avenues may also be useful to Allen.


              Unfortunately, most of the non-DNA avenues would not be useful to Allen. Most adoptees are entitled to obtain non-identifying information from the adoption agency or the state (age and ethnicity of biological parents if nothing else). Some are able to use publicly available birth indexes to determine their names at birth. The best and sometimes the only non-DNA way to get a father's name (seldom on the birth certificate) is to "ask Mom". I'm assuming that he's already tried to get a name out of his various relatives who all knew.

              What is available - DNA testing and standard genealogical records. Where was Mom living at the time of his conception? Then just list the possibilities: boyfriend/casual acquaintance, rape, older married/unmarried man (teacher/professor, employer). It is not an easy task. The only people who would have information (all of which needs to be taken with a grain of salt) are Allen's relatives.

              And I totally get the "living abortion" reference. I know adoptees who have been called that to their faces.

              Gaye

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by gtc View Post
                I read Allen's story as not adopted, but with a similar problem. Adoptees use various avenues of research outside of DNA testing in their search for biological parents(s), and I'm hoping that those avenues may also be useful to Allen.
                It appears he has the same problem as someone who has NPE on there tree with no record of father. Not all NPE's are adoptions. When there is no paper record of father, DNA testing would be the only option in possibly locating the truth. Especially if his mother never told anyone his alleged father's name.

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                • #9
                  This thread really resonated for me!

                  I, too, am trying to find the truth of a possible adoption or Non-Parental event in Minnesota, with birth parent (s) being Finnish.

                  But it happened almost 50 years earlier than the original post, in Ely, MN.

                  I think it's really a matter of piecing together clues.

                  For me, it was the Family Finder DNA test results that made me take a closer look at something odd on my maternal grandmother's 1902 birth certificate. The birthplace of both her parents (recent immigrants from Slovenia) was listed as Finland. I dismissed it as a clerical error. Lots of Finns in that community, I knew.

                  But then, an analysis of my Family Finder results (by one of those "outside projects") turned up a surprising bit of possible Native American ancestry--which can sometimes also mean Finnish.

                  The other clue: My mother's reaction to this possibility. Just as the original poster said, it "fit" for her. Lots of things about her mother and the family dynamics suddenly made sense. My mother actually wants to get tested now, to see if we can get a clearer picture. Like if she shows up with a higher "Native American" percentage, or gets a bunch of Finnish matches with Family finder, those would be clues.

                  In Minnesota, there are supposed to be adoption archives maintained by the state. Supposed to be public and available to anyone after 100 years, though I am getting some mixed signals about that. For more recent adoptions, there are more stringent rules, and birth certificate information is available only to adoptees and birth parents under certain conditions.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    link to Minnesota Adoption Archives

                    This is for AllenUnknown. Good luck!

                    http://www.dhs.state.mn.us/main/idcp...ame=id_006854#

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by bkilpatrick View Post
                      In Minnesota, there are supposed to be adoption archives maintained by the state. Supposed to be public and available to anyone after 100 years, though I am getting some mixed signals about that. For more recent adoptions, there are more stringent rules, and birth certificate information is available only to adoptees and birth parents under certain conditions.
                      bkilpatrick,
                      You might also want to check the Minnesota Historical Society website. They have birth and death indexes for that period online.

                      And more generally, I just found this page from MNHS regarding adoptions. Hope it helps.
                      Last edited by nathanm; 4 April 2011, 12:31 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by AllenUnknown View Post
                        Y-dna matches point to a few surnames.....Anderson, Peterson, Jakobsen, Jussila. I am still learning the art and science of all of this. It is extremely interesting. Have to be careful to keep it from becoming obsession. Allen Appleby
                        I'm glad you got some answers to explain your childhood!

                        You may already know this, but the surnames from your paternal origin change with each generation. You should read them as:

                        Son of Ander
                        Son of Peter
                        Son of Jakob.

                        That is why they are different.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by JamesKelley View Post
                          You may already know this, but the surnames from your paternal origin change with each generation. You should read them as:

                          Son of Ander
                          Son of Peter
                          Son of Jakob.

                          That is why they are different.
                          Just thought I'd mention that all Anderson's, Andersen's, Hanson's, Hansen's etc. living in Scandinavia today inherit those surnames from their parents. In Norway, pre-1900, the son of Anders would be Andersen. I don't know when the other countries left the old patronym system.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Yaffa View Post
                            Being that your mother married "Red" a few months before you were born, Im taking it Red just signed your birth certificate as your legal father. You were not adopted, correct?

                            If this is the case, I hope you did a 67 Y-DNA marker. Your direct father line if they are out there somewhere would have to match you very close to 67 marker

                            Family Finder may help if you ever find a close match that might be willing to Y DNA test if they haven't. You might also want to test with 23andme since they have some different markers than Family Finder.
                            As a matter of fact, I did do a Y-67 test. No, I was not an "adoptee". There are no records or paper trails to follow. I have also done FamilyFinder test.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by AllenUnknown View Post
                              As a matter of fact, I did do a Y-67 test. No, I was not an "adoptee". There are no records or paper trails to follow. I have also done FamilyFinder test.
                              Well than the best you can do is wait for a close 67 marker match. You could also try taking the 23andme test since they do have some different markers than Family Finder and this way you may get more matches. I have 7 people in your situation on my tree but they fall in from the mid 1800's or before! In your situation you are lucky you are male and can Y-DNA test.

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