Why don't Indian Tribes in the US test their DNA??

[deniseneufeld]

Why don't Indian Tribes in the US test their DNA?? One genealogist told me that
Indian Tribe members in the US won't have their DNA tested, does anyone know why?

[Javelin]

It's politics.

The US government already does not recognize many groups as official tribes for political reasons (e.g. they were on the wrong side in the war of Independence). In some states and counties, birth records were changed retroactively so that mainly Native American people with slight African American admixture were classified as "Black."

So what is to be gained by testing? The perception is this is an opportunity for governments to cast doubt on land and treaty/status claims.

[Brunetmj]

There also may be a fundamental religious beliefs at play.
Perhaps shared with many indigenous people around the world. The people sprang from mother earth where they live , or once lived,- not Africa
This was alluded to in the national geographic
movie on DNA testing

[Zaru]

There also may be a fundamental religious beliefs at play.
Perhaps shared with many indigenous people around the world. The people sprang from mother earth where they live , or once lived,- not Africa
This was alluded to in the national geographic
movie on DNA testing

I missed seeing that film. Are you in a position to elaborate more about that? I know that there are many people who do not subscribe fully to the Theory of Evolution, and that humanity sprang from various sources/ or were developed by a literal higher form of life.

Is this partially what the film was discussing?

Cheers.

[Brunetmj]

Is this partially what the film was discussing?

Not really. In the film he is explaining DNA testing to austrailian bushman and native Americans . It was apparent in the documentary that they were very polite but not buying it. They also offered thier explanation of where they came from.

[nathanm]

I don't think there's a resistance among Native Americans in general to having their DNA tested. There are a few who regularly post on this forum, and are just as interested in using genetic methods for researching their genealogy as the rest of us.

However, as Javelin pointed out above, sometimes politics get involved. For example, see the comments by a Cornell University professor in the article, "American Indian Program Opposes Genetic Ancestry Project."

Prof. Eric Cheyfitz, English, criticized National Geographic's language about diversity and said that the project "deconstruct[s] communal identities by individualizing members" of marginalized communities, such as indigenous peoples.

"In marked contrast to the goals of the Cornell Ancestry Event, which seeks to define 'diversity' biologically in terms of universal genetic codes ... Indigenous peoples customarily define themselves not biologically, but socio-culturally and politically in terms of varying ideas of nationhood," the statement says.

"[The project] is ahistorical in that it substitutes a biological profile of one's identity for one's historical (social and political) connections to a particular community. This clearly has an impact, among others, on historically underrepresented groups in the U.S. — African Americans, Asian Americans, Latino/as, and Native Americans — in that a biological profile can be dissociative in relation to one's history," Cheyfitz said in an e-mail.

If you have trouble understanding his postmodernist gobbledygook, don't worry, you're not supposed to. It's intended to sound scholarly and erudite to the initiated, i.e. those with a PhD in cultural studies. But to the rest of us, it's just pretentious nonsense.

I don't think anyone would disagree we identify ourselves in different ways. Just think of all the adoptees on here and elsewhere. They inherited their biology from their birth parents, but probably identify more closely, socially and otherwise, with their adopted family.

Some of his students made statements that were just as meaningless:

Dajahi Wiley '14, a student affiliated with AIP, pointed to historical trends that challenge what the AIP statement refers to as the project's "homogenizing fantasy of a diversity where we all somehow wind up being the same."

"For centuries, non-white peoples have been called fundamentally different from whites in physical and cultural ways. Now, there are groups and projects like the Genetic Ancestry Project that claim that everyone is basically the same," Wiley said. "While the former was and is maliciously racist, the latter represents, at best, a naive understanding of the world and social dynamics. As such, this is a topic of concern not only for American Indians, but all communities of color."

In other words, he wants to have it both ways. And from a former student:

"What AIP objects to I think ... is the way in which the Genetic Ancestry Project appears apolitical and acultural when in fact there are very real, but implicit, political and cultural sentiments expressed in it," Curley said. "In other words, AIP sees the Genetic Ancestry Project as constructing a meta-narrative of human history and has objection to some of the assumptions and characterizations made in this process."

If there's any actual reluctance to take DNA tests among Native Americans, it's probably because they've been fed postmodernist BS from professors of his ilk. Sadly, this is the state of the humanities at many institutions of higher education in the US today.

[ahernandez]

I missed seeing that film. Are you in a position to elaborate more about that? I know that there are many people who do not subscribe fully to the Theory of Evolution, and that humanity sprang from various sources/ or were developed by a literal higher form of life.

Is this partially what the film was discussing?

Cheers.

It's not so much anti-evolution per se, but a strongly held belief that a native people were born of their ancestral land, and not just an individual, but the whole tribe.

For example, a Southwest tribe has a rich trove of myths about how their people were created in the Southwest. And now here comes Spencer Wells with his “Science” saying, well you’re not technically native Native Americas you all came over from Asia during the last Ice age.

[charleslow]

I think everyone is beating arround the bush.If some Natives were to be tested for their DNA , it would show that their majority of percentage would be some other admixture besides Native American. The Government would have a field day with this info. Lets stop being so political correct and say it the way it is.

[Brunetmj]

The Government would have a field day with this info. Lets stop being so political correct

Why a field day ? I mean if the government actually paid any attention to DNA testing they would find themselves in a bind. The goverment has ruled that DNA testing cannot be used for entry into any tribe. They argue that it is culture and traditions not biology. Consequently they cannot remove anyone from a tribe based on DNA . In addition the tribes do not allow entry based on DNA. If both your paternal and maternal DNA was native American you could not suddenly affiliate yourself with a tribe if none existed before

[deniseneufeld]

Thanks for all the input, I have Native mtDNA, I always thought I got the darker features from my grandfather who was Mexican Indian. I always thought my grandmother was more Spanish, but she also had Native DNA. I am really curious what tribe my maternal ancestor came from, I guess the Family Finder test give percentages. I just want to know for myself. Do you think a full genome test
would give those kind of results? Would it show what ancestor had more Native Markers??

[ahernandez]

No, Population Finder can only tell you that you have a certain percentage of Native American ancestry fairly accurately, but it can't tell you what particular tribe because they have a limited number of NA tribes as references. So you'll most likely get variation of Pima, Maya or Columbia regardless of where in the Americas your original tribe was from.

[Brunetmj]

There are many people on this site who are more knowledgeable than me on these matters so please don't take this as fact.
Having said that I do not believe that testing in of itself would establish a particular tribe. However perhaps a family finder might help by finding a match somewhere who could establish a tribe.
Personally I would focus on traditional geneology and try to establish a paper trail.

[PDHOTLEN]

RE "Indian" DNA

To start with, most people only get the basic mtDNA & Y-DNA tested. Those are only two threads in a person's genetic makeup. But they make for interesting traces, historically. One close match to mine was surprised to find out that they had white ancestry, and apparently refused to believe the results. But that sort of thing makes for interesting historical speculation.

[ragincajun]

I think a lot of American Indians don't want to dna test because they feel they already know who they are and don't need to prove it to anyone. Unfortunately, Indians are the only ones who have to prove who they are.

If a person tells you he is white, you accept that at face value. Not so for Indians. Just my opinion.

[deniseneufeld]

I think a lot of American Indians don't want to dna test because they feel they already know who they are and don't need to prove it to anyone. Unfortunately, Indians are the only ones who have to prove who they are.

If a person tells you he is white, you accept that at face value. Not so for Indians. Just my opinion.

I don't belong to a tribe but I am part Indian, I took the DNA test to see
what Haplogroup A, B, C or D, I am Haplogroup B