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Question on Polish and Czech 12 marker R1a matches

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  • Question on Polish and Czech 12 marker R1a matches

    My R1a line is recently from Poland but might go back to another country. My 12 marker matches are slightly higher in the Czech Republic(1.9) than in Poland(1.3).

    My closest match at more markers is Polish but there are 5 times as many Polish samples and I do have some close Czech ones.

    Do people with Polish R1a have the most 12 marker matches in Poland or the Czech Republic? Would the Czech matches point to a Czech ancestor?

    My 12 Marker Czech repubic matches are 1.9%.My 12 marker Polish matches are 1.3%

    5 -
    Czech Republic 5 Bohemia 12 621 1.9%
    2 Czechoslovakia

    Poland 36 - 41 3,271 1.3%
    5 Prussia


  • #2
    I'm not an expert, but the general advice I've seen given to others that asked similar questions on this forum in the past is to test beyond 12 markers. The higher you match, the better. A handful of exact matches, or even just one match, at 37, or better yet, 67 markers, is what people aim for. Forget about 12 markers, unless that is all you have. One 67/67 match in one population is better than a hundred 12/12 matches in another population.

    My father claimed/claims to be of (half) Czech descent. I did the paper trail and found out my ancestors were Slovak, not Czech. They were listed as Austrian in one USA document. I thought they were Roman Catholic, but they attended a Polish Catholic church. What I am saying is is that sometimes people in the USA will blend in with the closest dominant group, especially from Austro-Hungarian areas. People who were not German, but from a smaller group, and knew how to speak or read German, may claim to be German to blend in.


    • #3
      Thanks for responding,

      I have actually tested 67 markers and my closest match is Polish but its far from an exact match. I have other similar matches from Germany and Czech republic etc.

      Its true that 12 markers are much less important than higher markers but there have been much less people tested in the Czech republic. I am not sure that its a level comparison at higher markers.

      I was just curious if people with a Polish R1a line had a higher percentage of Polish or Czech Matches at 12 markers?


      • #4
        Originally posted by brian87 View Post
        I was just curious if people with a Polish R1a line had a higher percentage of Polish or Czech Matches at 12 markers?
        The sum of the mutation rates of the first 12 markers is only 0.02243, roughly 1 mutation per 45 generations (roughly 1350 years). Thus, your list of 12-marker matches roughly corresponds to the descendants of your patrilineal ancestor from 1350 years ago.

        If your 12-marker match list is more Czech than Polish percentagewise, it indeed may indicate that your 1350-year-old patrilineal ancestor lived in Bohemia. This especially makes sense if you belong to the N Type of the R1a1 haplogroup. N Type appears to center its concentration near the Czech Republic, so it may have begun its most recent and most rapid expansion there.

        Your match lists at higher levels of resolution (higher marker counts) are a better indication of where your patrilineal ancestors lived more recently.

        Also: I am not at all certain that the percentage of Polish-Americans who have tested with FTDNA is larger than the percentage of Czech-Americans who have done so. Total numbers for Czech ancestry are smaller, of course, but that may simply be because the Czech Republic's population is smaller than that of Poland, and also perhaps the percentage of the Polish population that immigrated to America is larger.
        FTDNA Customer
        Last edited by lgmayka; 28 October 2010, 04:15 PM.