King Tut's DNA

[rainbow]

I have neither said or implied that you were being misleading; only that your facts on the matter are incorrect.

I wrote, "Did you really just say that?" and "Your history appears to be fabricated." (Seriously; you could have just scrolled down a bit to verify that.) Appears the person bent out of shape (and thin skinned) for having a mistake pointed out is you.

Now please excuse me while I climb back into the saddle on my high horse.

You said he fabricated, which means lying. He wasn't lying. Enjoy your "high horse" and go run at windmills.

[Darren]

While we encourage lively discussions please let us stick to debating the topic and avoid directing comments aimed at a particular user.

-Darren Marin
Family Tree DNA

[EricSilver]

You said he fabricated, which means lying. He wasn't lying. Enjoy your "high horse" and go run at windmills.

After this I feel less compelled to respond to your previous remark -- but I will do so in a moment.

Edward may have been telling the truth about *seeing* a Discovery Channel program, but the specific assertion he presented here (that single Greek general spawned all Egyptian kings) was not what that program broadcast. Not even close. (In the age of Google, fact-checking is just a few mouse-clicks away and should done before making such an outlandish claim.)

Regarding your R1b remark, Tut’s R1b does not represent his family any more than my "Nordic" I1 represents my family (or the R1b of black American men with European Y-Haplotypes, of which there are many, represents theirs). It is only a part of the whole from which maternal/mtDNA is being inexplicably disregarded. An intelligent conversation cannot be built on that foundation.

Something to consider is that humans of that time co-mingled more freely than people today may realize, particularly since Egypt and the immediate area were centers of commerce -- the New York City of the day. Naturally, in addition to the exchange of goods and services, there would be personal, intimate commerce through which the exchange of DNA would occur. Egyptian royalty, with access to essentially whatever women they wanted, and already having large harems, would not hesitate to take a pretty foreign concubine. And because there were no artificial ethnic/"racial" barriers and taboos like those we live with in the modern day, they would not think twice about raising the children born of such unions as their own.

It is well documented that Egyptians (and their descendants) travelled far and wide, i.e.:

“Herodotus cited a story told by Egyptian priests about a Pharaoh Sesostris, who once led an army northward through Syria and Turkey all the way to Colchis, westward across Southern Russia, and then south again through Romania, until he reached Bulgaria and the Eastern part of Greece. Sesostris then returned home the same way he came, leaving colonists behind at the Colchian river Phasis. Herodotus cautioned the reader that much of this story came second hand via Egyptian priests, but also noted that the Colchians were commonly known to be Egyptian colonists.[1]”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sesostris

So an interesting question is whether the R1b was acquired when a carrier came to Egypt; or if they brought it back with them after some journey like the one above. NOTE: The path Sesotris took passes right through Armenia, which you cited. As he was 12th Dynasty and Tutankhamen 18th Dynasty, it might be fun to speculate that his R1b was acquired on this journey. But for the reasons stated above (trade and commerce), I would wager the strain was present earlier.

[EdwardRHill]

Thanks Elizabeth I should have checked Wikipedia before I posted the comment. But who knew a jack @@@ would come along and get bent out of shape by it. How he justifies what he say tells me he's not worth the time or effort.

[EdwardRHill]

Does this mean I'm part Egyptian?

King Tut.............................Me

DYS 19 - 14 (? not clear)......14
DYS 385a - 11....................12
DYS 385b - 14....................14
DYS 389i - 13.....................13
DYS 389ii - 30....................30
DYS 390 - 24.....................23
DYS 391 - 11.....................10
DYS 392 - 13.....................13
DYS 393 - 13.....................13
DYS 437 - 14 (? not clear)...15
DYS 438 - 12.....................12
DYS 439 - 10.....................13
DYS 448 - 19.....................19
DYS 456 - 15.....................15
DYS 458 - 16.....................16
DYS 635 - 23.....................23
YGATAH4 - 11....................13

and does it come with any benefits ?

[Max von Pif]

*bing* "what is Ptolemy?"

[PDHOTLEN]

Turkish? I doubt it.

Anatolian would seem to be more correct. The Turks didn't arrive in "Turkey" until much later. But that's just off the top of my head. I haven't looked anything up.

[EdwardRHill]

Who is Ptolemy? you asked

Who is Ptolemy? you asked

Claudius Ptolemaeus (Greek: Klaudios Ptolemaios; c AD 90- c. 168), known in English as Ptolemy, was a Roman citizen of Egypt who wrote in Greek. He was a mathematicain, astronomer, geographer, astrologer and a poet of a single epigram in the Greek Anthology. He live in Egypt under Roman rule, and is believed to have been born in the town of Ptolemais Hermiou in the Thebaid. He died in Alexandria around AD 168.

something tells me you already knew this

[EricSilver]

King Tut.............................Meand does it come with any benefits ?

After all the discussion that yDNA, alone, does not establish ethnic identity, you respond with... a yDNA sample and ask if that makes you part Egyptian.

Here's the answer and a question: Does my I1 yDNA make me part Norwegian? No. First, Egyptian/Norwegian are nationalities, not ethnicities. Anyone could be a citizen of either place regardless of their genetics. Second, and repeating it once again, you would need the entire genetic makeup to make such a determination (from a DNA premise).

yDNA from Tut and also from his mother's father(or his brothers); and mtDNA from Tut and also from his father's mother (or her sisters) would allow you to paint the most accurate portrait. Any anthropologist or crime lab, doing the analysis based on physical material (of mummies) already in hand would easily make the determination without DNA – and already have on numerous occasions.

In post number 17 of this thread we see:
"Tutankhamen's STR results are up on ySearch. His ID is ER7RQ. Results can be seen at: http://www.ysearch.org/haplosearch_v...wuid=ER7RQ&p=0
There are four guys who have a GD of zero on 10 markers." In post 19 it is further stated, "The four matches on ySearch are all Europeans."

After running the results for 10 matches w/Zero the results showed one person in Germany and the rest unknown. (Let's endeavor to report information accurately, and close any credibility gaps.) When viewing their comparative yDNA results I noticed something that recurs when comparing my results to Europeans: Like Tut, I have no 426 & 388 markers whereas Europeans almost always do. Perhaps that is one of the things that occur when African and European DNA mix.

Finally, looking at your markers, you have 11 that are zero-GD . Given your track record on the accurate reporting of information I am inclined to question their veracity. Nonetheless a ySearch on 11 markers with GD of zero shows only 18th-Dynasty matches. Consider shooting an email to Zahi Hawass with your results, and report back here with the outcome (unless you have a reason not to).

[EdwardRHill]

Guy it was a joke

Guy I posted just to see your reply.

[Darren]

I have asked all posters to keep discussions on topic and to refrain from personal comments or singling out a single user. Since these parameters cannot be kept I am closing this thread.

-Darren Marin
Family Tree DNA