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DNA Tribes, High Mestizo Score?

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  • DNA Tribes, High Mestizo Score?

    I've recently gotten back my 21 marker DNA Tribes report, and I was surprised to see that my profile had such an affinity to Mestizo populations. 19 out of 20 Global matches were to Mestizo populations, and my highest Regions score, by a multiple of 8 compared to second highest, was to "Mestizo".

    This was surprising, because oral history and paper trails tell me I'm of Irish, German, Dutch, English and Scottish ancestry. I've previously never had any reason to believe I had Mestizo, Hispanic or Native American ancestry.

    I'd be very interested to hear from other people who had high Mestizo scores and to hear about their traditional paper-trail ancestry and what any other testing, in particular 23andme, has revealed about their biological ancestry.

    Here are my results, with MLI scores:

    Native Population Match Results:

    (All are "Lowest")
    Bucharest, Romania 45.80
    Glasgow, Scotland 40.46
    Afghanistan 39.42
    Northern Ireland 37.95
    Greece 37.69
    Greece 36.13
    Ireland 35.56
    Denmark 34.45
    Greece 34.04
    Dundee, Scotland 27.95
    Toulouse, France 27.44
    Republic of Ireland 25.75
    Tuscany, Italy 25.65
    Ashkenazi (Budapest, Hungary) 25.24
    Strathclyde, Scotland 25.13
    Kharkov, Ukraine 24.56
    Bosnia 24.55
    Southeast Poland 19.56
    Hamburg, Germany 17.43
    Macedonian 16.94

    Global Population Match Results:

    Costa Rica 451.60 (Strongest)
    Costa Rica 434.08 (Strongest)
    Boyaca, Colombia 151.86
    Hispanic (Arizona, U.S.A.) 149.02
    Santander, Colombia 138.53
    Hispanic (U.S.A.) 119.01
    Central Andean Region, Colombia 98.28
    Costa Rica 93.40
    Quindio, Colombia 84.38
    Mestizo (Honduras) 77.87
    Caracas, Venezuela 76.60
    Caldas, Colombia 74.28
    Chubut, Argentina 74.02
    Colombia 70.79
    Colombia 67.35
    Buenos Aires, Argentina 67.04
    Mestizo (Argentina) 61.85
    El Salvador 60.50
    Hispanic (Michigan, U.S.A.) 60.19
    European-Aboriginal (mixed) (Queensland, Australia) 59.47

    World Region Match Results (>1 only):

    Mestizo 127.13
    Northwest European 14.96
    Eastern European 8.68
    Aegean 8.21
    North India 8.18
    Mediterranean 5.28
    Mesopotamian 2.35
    South India 2.24
    Eastern India 1.84
    Levantine 1.03

  • #2
    Your scores are weak, and the algorithm is clearly struggling to find matches for you. The results show a mixed European background, and because none of the Spanish populations ( http://www.dnatribes.com/pops-eur.html ) appear in your Native matches, I suspect Spain is not part of your background.

    Regards,
    Jim

    Comment


    • #3
      Yes, I agree there's no indication of Spanish ancestry. But "Mestizo" is not equivalent to "Spanish".

      According to Tribes, Mestizos are "Native Americans who have blended with Europeans and (to a lesser degree) Africans in recent history." A high Mestizo score may be an indication of NA and/or African ancestry in someone who also has European ancestry, and by Tribes' own internal measures, my Mestizo score on the Regions section is high. It's above the 75th percentile for US Caucasians and above the 50th percentile for US Hispanics.

      It's my highest Regions score, and dividing the Mestizo MLI by the Northwest European one, my profile is 8.5 times likelier to be found in Mestizo regions than NW European ones.

      Comment


      • #4
        E-mail them for a better answer.

        I have the same, and was told it is due to small sampling of my true populations.

        Comment


        • #5
          I did and got the "most consistent with 1/4 Native American" answer.

          It would be surprising, but I can't totally rule out the possibility of NA ancestry. My mother's family has lived in rural upstate NY and northern NJ since at least the 18th century, when many Native Americans were in the area and intermarriage wasn't unknown. I'm doing 23andme testing too as a way to confirm or invalidate the DNAT results.

          You say that your DNAT results were similar, rucksack. Would you mind telling me your Regions score for Mestizo? Was it, like mine, highest of all of your regions scores? And what is your known ancestry?

          Comment


          • #6
            For High Res World Regions:

            Mestizo (0.55) 49.94 This is my highest. As you can tell, there are pretty low "Highs". Someone said "Your MLIs are not only very low, they're extremely low".

            I am 100% Finnish for hundreds and hundreds of years.

            A Finnish friend says:

            Mestizo and all equivalent results can be dropped out, because they are result of a tiny shade of applicable Finnish references, which looses connections to their Finnish reference window and start to look like Native American connection. DnaTribes told me that this happens. This, with an Iberian result in your total result, leads to this a strange combination result of Mestizo inheritance.


            "High Res Native Populations Match Results" and "DNA Tribes Europa Results", being only results without confusion caused by the poor Finnish reference data, have some similar traits with my result. We both have an Iberian emphasis, but your results stonger Russian part plays significant role in this context. In fact I have only a very tiny shade of Russian in my genes, although we live in the same region. It seems like your inheritance leads to a more unpredictable result than mine. My result is quite understandable considering these problems with Finnish references.
            Last edited by rucksack; 4 May 2009, 12:38 AM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by drouhin View Post
              I did and got the "most consistent with 1/4 Native American" answer.

              It would be surprising, but I can't totally rule out the possibility of NA ancestry. My mother's family has lived in rural upstate NY and northern NJ since at least the 18th century, when many Native Americans were in the area and intermarriage wasn't unknown. I'm doing 23andme testing too as a way to confirm or invalidate the DNAT results.

              You say that your DNAT results were similar, rucksack. Would you mind telling me your Regions score for Mestizo? Was it, like mine, highest of all of your regions scores? And what is your known ancestry?

              I'm wondering if you and I are related. My unknown Native American is from northwestern New Jersey.
              I had an admixture test in 2006 from DNAPrint/AncestryByDna and they said I am 17% Native American. My mom then tested but got zero Native American. So that means it is from my father and his mothers family is/was from New Jersey (a branch of distant cousins did move to upstate New York).

              And I tested with DNA Tribes and they say my str profile is consistent with 1/8 to 1/4 Native American ancestry.

              My fathers father was Czechoslovakian, so I rule his side out. My unknown Native American must be from my fathers mother. Her family history is English, Dutch (Holland), French, Scottish, German (from what used to be German-speaking Alsace, but is part of present-day France, I think).


              In my current DNA Tribes, I have 13 Latin American (1 to Puerto Ricans and 12 to Brazilians) matches in my top 20 global. I have no Native American matches in my "part b" top 20. My world region section matches me, at 1.00 and above, to twelve world regions. My top world region match is North African (0.32) 64.10
              The sixth one, Mestizo, is (0.45) 28.41.

              Comment


              • #8
                Unless my Czechoslovakian grandfather was part Native American. My great grandfather, who was Czechoslovakian, came to the US (NY) by ship but then went to Canada and Minnesota for a while before going back to the east coast (NY/NJ).

                And he was from the West Tatras, which is actually in present-day Slovakia, but I was told he was Czech. I also think it's possible that he had a little Finnish influence. I match the three Finland categories in my DNA Tribes extended report.

                My Finland scores:

                Finland (0.26) 19.96
                Finland (0.23) 16.68
                Finland (0.230 15.01



                In my Native American panel, I have Athabaskan (Alaska) at (0.01) 0.01.
                The rest are all zeros. But this time, instead of Salish and Cree immediately following Athabaskan, I now various others interspersed between Cree & Salish. I have (at second place) Hnu Hnu (Otomi) (Hidalgo, Mexico), and then Coast Salish, then Chol Maya, then Coast Salish again, then Cree, then Puna (Andean Region, Northwest Argentina), then Otomi (La Sierra Madre), then Cree again, then Otomi (Ixmiquilpan Valley), then Yucatan Mayan.


                My Mestizo is (0.45) 28.41
                My Finno-Ugrian is (0.25) 17.59
                Last edited by rainbow; 6 May 2009, 07:26 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  rainbow, have you done 23andme testing? I'd be interested to see what their ancestry painting feature would do with your ancestry.

                  But I'd be happy to do 23andme sharing with you just on the basis of both of us having old northern NJ ancestry. My sample is being processed now, and I haven't really figured out the sharing thing, but it's probably pretty intuitive.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by drouhin View Post
                    rainbow, have you done 23andme testing? I'd be interested to see what their ancestry painting feature would do with your ancestry.

                    But I'd be happy to do 23andme sharing with you just on the basis of both of us having old northern NJ ancestry. My sample is being processed now, and I haven't really figured out the sharing thing, but it's probably pretty intuitive.

                    Hi.
                    I haven't tested with 23andme. I tested with DNAPrint in 2006. I had tested to see if I had any East Asian ancestry from my Slavic grandfather. I had read that Eastern Europeans get 10% East Asian. Since I am a quarter (1/4) Eastern European, I thought I could have about 2% or 3% East Asian (1/4 of 10%). My mom always said she thought I was part Mongolian on my fathers side. The Mongols (from Asia) invaded Eastern Europe a long time ago and some blended with the local populations.
                    I was completely stunned with my 17% Native American result. And stunned again when my mom had zero. I had thought that if I had any Native American ancestry, that it would be on my mothers mothers side (from North Carolina, South Carolina, Virginia). My original test was with the Genographic Project, to find out if my mtdna was English or Native American. My earliest known direct female ancestor was from Virginia. My mtdna came back as European/English H1.
                    Getting back to my 17% NA, I think it is from my fathers mother, who was from New Jersey. Old New Jersey, since the 1700s. But for me to have 17%, she would have to be at least half. I estimated she would be 68% more or less.

                    But I have no known American Indian paper-trail ancestry from her side. I'm guessing maybe she was adopted. She was born in 1928. Maybe she was given up for adoption after the great depression in 1929? Either that or her parents family lines had been a mixture of European and Native American (most likely Lenape, commonly known as Delaware Indian) for centuries, since colonial times.

                    I have no idea what ancestry painting is. But it would be great to compare our dna. I would love it if DNA Tribes were to collect dna from people from the old families in NJ and see how much Native American admixture there is there. Then that could be my next top match, instead of far-off 'Sergipe, Brazil'.
                    Last edited by rainbow; 15 May 2009, 10:19 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Mestizo Matches

                      My Mestizo score was 759.63 and my highest individual score was Spanish, at 51,000 something, followed by French at 10,000 something

                      Would that quailfy?

                      I got no reply from DNATribes, in the past I did get a 1/4th Native American reply.

                      Now, from photos of Great Grandmothers I pretty much know that NA is in the blood line as well as some Cherokee ancestry. I know there is French too, and that was second from the Spanish. But I have NO Spanish ancestry, well, none that I know of.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        That is indeed a high MLI for Mestizo! According to DNA Tribes, it's well above the 95th percentile for US Caucasians and African Americans, and high enough to be outside the "ordinary" range for US Hispanics. I don't think you need Spanish ancestry to score high for Mestizo; it's supposed to indicate any type of Euro or African ancestry mixed with Native American ancestry.

                        Is "Mestizo" your highest Regions match? And have you done any other autosomal testing, like 23andme?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Wow! 759.63 is a super high MLI score. What is your TribeScore (0.??) ?

                          My latest update has my Mestizo (0.46) 28.41.
                          My top individual match (part b) is Syria (0.58) 183.82.

                          And I thought my new ones were high because my average scores used to be around 20.
                          I remember that lots of people get super high scores, even into the thousands, and millions!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I will send complete results soon. On this last test I matched a actual Mestizo from Argentina in the diaspora results.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by drouhin View Post
                              ... I don't think you need Spanish ancestry to score high for Mestizo; it's supposed to indicate any type of Euro or African ancestry mixed with Native American ancestry...
                              Actually Tribes' "Mestizo" can be found among Europeans and others with no Native American ancestry. Check-out any PDF for an individual population or Tribes' Global Affinties PDF.

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