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  • 23andME -- DeCodeMe

    HELLO ; May be a silly question ,do they test paternal ,as well as maternal ,as Im only interested now in paternal results , & will the results be very general ( re ethnicity ) ?.Thanks .. KAT.

  • #2
    Hi Kat,
    As far as I know, they do the Y paternal testing, MtDNA and autosomal.
    But they will only do the Y test if you are male or have a male relative.
    Autosomal results are a bit like a mixture of a Tribes report and an AbDNA report but it will show you your admixture percentages per chromosome so you can see where the admixture has come from.
    23andme have a higher threshold for Europeans and anything over 1% East Asian is supposed to be significant.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by burto
      Hi Kat,
      As far as I know, they do the Y paternal testing, MtDNA and autosomal.
      But they will only do the Y test if you are male or have a male relative.
      Autosomal results are a bit like a mixture of a Tribes report and an AbDNA report but it will show you your admixture percentages per chromosome so you can see where the admixture has come from.
      23andme have a higher threshold for Europeans and anything over 1% East Asian is supposed to be significant.
      Even less than 1% is significant as it represents a haploblock of say 10 million base pairs and if you see something, anything, in orange (their coding for Asian), you can be reasonably assured that you have some degree of Asian or Native American (they color both orange) so you will need to know something of your ancestry to figure out which is which. If ABDNA did not have an ancestral informative SNP in that particular block then on their test you may be 0% Asian. However you could also end up 10% Native when there is no NA in the genome.

      We are talking about a test (23andme) which uses about 20,000 of their half million SNPs to do the calculations, not 176 markers or 21 markers. The latter two are highly likely to either miss minority ancestry (false negative) or "detect" minority ancestry (false positive).

      Soon 23andme will be painting the X chromsome which according to my decodeme results should have both Asian and African elements - but who knows, since they all set the bar differently. If there is nothing there then I accept that my documented NA ancestry is largely just on paper and that very little trace has been left on my autosomes or X chromosome (and so even less for my children and grandchildren).

      Comment


      • #4
        DKF did you take 23andme?

        DKF.

        I noticed a posting dated Sept 26, 2008 on Rootsweb. You stated that soon they would be painting the x chromosome. Am I correct in assuming that you opted to take the test. Would love to see your results...Would you be willing to share your 23andme results like you did with the decodeme results...

        Maria

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Maria_W
          DKF.

          I noticed a posting dated Sept 26, 2008 on Rootsweb. You stated that soon they would be painting the x chromosome. Am I correct in assuming that you opted to take the test. Would love to see your results...Would you be willing to share your 23andme results like you did with the decodeme results...

          Maria
          Maria, I have taken the 23andme test, but the only people they allow to share genomes are those who have also taken the same test. I am pleased to share with anyone who has taken the plunge here. Using the search feature I am fauxdk.

          It is important to note that not only is this the best test for finding minority ancestry (although unlikely if someone has only one ancestor of that group and born earlier than about 1800) seen via "Ancestry Painting", but also with the advanced feature (in alpha testing) for "Global Ancestry" it can place a person such as myself perfectly within a very small section of the planet based on the whole genome via testing half a million SNPs. It shows me at the junction of France, Germany, England, and Norway. This reflects the reality of 66% of my known heritage. Despite being 1/16 Irish this does not bring me anywhere near the area with the many Irish samples.

          This is the litmus test and if people wonder why I scoff at the multiple Arab matches I have in a test that uses 21 markers it is because people are getting random convergent matches that are meaningless - but are trying to figure out where they got their "Arab" or whatever from - from nowhere - it is all an illusion. The test using 176 markers and purporting to tell you what percentage is SE or SW or whatever European is also going to be hopelessly misleading. Only the 23andme test can literally pinpoint one's genome on a map. The other tests provide phantom ancestries and if one is adopted then good luck in making sense of any of it. None of them can detect ancestries from say an ancestor who was born in the early 1700s except on rare occasions by chance. The only way the 21 autosomal marker test can work (in theory) is if both of one's parents come from the same location.

          Within a few years there will be a test using not only SNPs but STRs and indels providing a powerful way to tease out different components of one's genome. So even tests like 23andme will one day be obsolete but for now and the next couple of years it is absolutely state of the art - and they will continue to find ways to present the data in meaningful ways as their scientists use the published literature to apply to 23andme customers. What you also get is the assignment of Y (if a male) and mtDNA haplogroup - in many cases to a very deep level of genotyping. To go the next step it is possible to take the raw data and locate new markers (this is how we found two new markers for me downstream of R-U152). This is also how we found what may be the most important SNP for person who is in the R1b category and of British ancestry - L21/S145 which appears to mark those whose Y ancestor was aboriginal to Ireland and Britain.

          Considering the fairly modest price now, I can't imagine a better value. Sorry, I got sidetracked but don't forget, you also get mucho info about disease and traits (their prime purpose). All of the above for the price of a minor repair to the brakes of my over-powered car with a 6.1 liter hemi engine (now sold and replaced with a small under-powered truck, much more suitable for someone in the process of retiring and who would rather spend available cash on worthwhile genetic tests).

          Comment


          • #6
            23andMe

            Dr Faux,

            23andMe test. I know someone who claims to have a significant amount of NA ancestry about 50% and I was told twice they could not get a reading on this person. At this point don't know if it is due to possible high NA ancestry or DNA sample was bad. Have you heard of this happening?

            I thought about taking the test but want to see more people's reaction to to test first and how many people are satisfied with results.

            Thanks
            Yaffa

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Yaffa
              Dr Faux,

              23andMe test. I know someone who claims to have a significant amount of NA ancestry about 50% and I was told twice they could not get a reading on this person. At this point don't know if it is due to possible high NA ancestry or DNA sample was bad. Have you heard of this happening?

              I thought about taking the test but want to see more people's reaction to to test first and how many people are satisfied with results.

              Thanks
              Yaffa
              Very unusual, but one of a hundred or so samples cannot be PCRed and there is no option but to ask the person for a new sample and start from square one. If a person follows the instructions to the letter there is seldom a problem, but yes if one say drinks coffee and then provides a saliva sample it will be contaminated.

              Yes, I am extremely satisfied with the 23andme test - way beyond my wildest expectations and hopes (although I kind of new what to expect since i had taken the decodeme test). A super bargain. It did not show the hoped for well documented Native American but that was from the 1700s so the result was anticipated. Still, I know from the decodeme test that I have large haploblocks of Asian and African on my X chromosome so we will see how 23andme interpret the findings at these sites. I am ok with any result since I know it will reflect what is real, not a phantom.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by DKF
                Very unusual, but one of a hundred or so samples cannot be PCRed and there is no option but to ask the person for a new sample and start from square one. If a person follows the instructions to the letter there is seldom a problem, but yes if one say drinks coffee and then provides a saliva sample it will be contaminated.

                Yes, I am extremely satisfied with the 23andme test - way beyond my wildest expectations and hopes (although I kind of new what to expect since i had taken the decodeme test). A super bargain. It did not show the hoped for well documented Native American but that was from the 1700s so the result was anticipated. Still, I know from the decodeme test that I have large haploblocks of Asian and African on my X chromosome so we will see how 23andme interpret the findings at these sites. I am ok with any result since I know it will reflect what is real, not a phantom.
                This person did send in another sample so I guess we shall see. I wanted to see how accurate it was at dermining NA ancestry being that this person has a high content of NA.If this test takes and it comes back accurat in general, will let you know. Im curious because not that many companies have a lot of NA to compare like other European DNA.

                Thanks for your imput
                Yaffa

                Comment


                • #9
                  Response

                  Thanks all for your input ,opinions..KAT.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Dr. Faux

                    Would 23andMe pinpoint as finely as say the Channel Islands or the Orkney Islands? I have a little theory going in my mind these days about one of the clades and the combination of common SNPS and divergent STRS. I was wondering whether 23andMe might be able to illustrate the effect, if any, of entry into the UK through the Orkney Islands as opposed to The Channel Islands to Rouen and then to UK or directly from the Channel Islands.
                    Last edited by Deirwha; 11 November 2008, 02:58 PM. Reason: oops. did snp twice

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Deirwha
                      Would 23andMe pinpoint as finely as say the Channel Islands or the Orkney Islands? I have a little theory going in my mind these days about one of the clades and the combination of common SNPS and divergent STRS. I was wondering whether 23andMe might be able to illustrate the effect, if any, of entry into the UK through the Orkney Islands as opposed to The Channel Islands to Rouen and then to UK or directly from the Channel Islands.
                      I think I can safely say a resounding no (unfortunately). The analyses are not quite that fine grained. Here is where genealogy comes in. The power in the technology is best realized through combining what one knows from each data source.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thank you

                        I am working that end of the egg as hard as I can. I seem some reason to hope. I am also trying to get info re: the distribution of haplogroups in the Orkney Islands and also the Channel Islands. I suspect that there is a lot more of my clade out there who have just not realized or been prepared to pay for the deep clade test.

                        U198
                        T*

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Those who have received NA in other tests

                          I am specficially directing this suggestion to those who have been surprised as to the percentage of for example Native American in their DNAT or ABDNA testing - receiving for example 15% NA but with no paper trail that would support this finding. I am hoping that these individuals will ultimately test with 23andme and find out if this was a valid finding, or a false positive.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Happy for you....

                            Sounds like you are really estatic about your 23and me results even though it didn't back up your Native American paper trail...
                            Why didn't it?
                            OK since it didn't show it up, then it likes look asian is really Asian.
                            I wonder what my decodeme test results would translate out to.
                            My results are:92% European, 6% Asian and 2% African American on Chromosome X .
                            My results are:87% European , 9% Asian and 4% African American on Chromosomes 1-22.
                            Is Asian stand in for Native or is it really Asian...
                            And why would a result of over 1% Asian on 23andme be more accurate than DeCodeMe's over 1% Asian.
                            I have a documented paper trail for my Potowomecke ancestor, even through it's in the 1600's...Matter of fact , I have new information that I have sent to our tribal historian for him to look over. It looks like my father also decends from the same ancestor, Wahangonoche, just different daughters...through the Elkins line of Virginia.
                            My test results on ABDNA was 10% Native American and 90% Indo European. DeCodeMe can't pick that up?
                            For 400.00 thats amazing.

                            What did this test do that DeCodeMe didn't do for you to be so happy?

                            Maria

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Maria_W
                              Sounds like you are really estatic about your 23and me results even though it didn't back up your Native American paper trail...
                              Why didn't it?
                              OK since it didn't show it up, then it likes look asian is really Asian.
                              I wonder what my decodeme test results would translate out to.
                              My results are:92% European, 6% Asian and 2% African American on Chromosome X .
                              My results are:87% European , 9% Asian and 4% African American on Chromosomes 1-22.
                              Is Asian stand in for Native or is it really Asian...
                              And why would a result of over 1% Asian on 23andme be more accurate than DeCodeMe's over 1% Asian.
                              I have a documented paper trail for my Potowomecke ancestor, even through it's in the 1600's...Matter of fact , I have new information that I have sent to our tribal historian for him to look over. It looks like my father also decends from the same ancestor, Wahangonoche, just different daughters...through the Elkins line of Virginia.
                              My test results on ABDNA was 10% Native American and 90% Indo European. DeCodeMe can't pick that up?
                              For 400.00 thats amazing.

                              What did this test do that DeCodeMe didn't do for you to be so happy?

                              Maria
                              Maria, we have discussed this before, based on the time period you would be at most 1/10,000 or something NA. No 21 or 176 marker test is ever going to be able to pick that up (unless by some remote chance factor). Your ABDNA scores are not consistent with your genealogy. The tests (particularly DNAT) simply gives people lots and lots of results most of which are entirely irrelevant but as long as the customer is happy or can be made happy by telling them that "your results are consistent" with this or that...........

                              21 markers versus one half a million markers - what value is the former unless it is a parlor game or just a fun exercise to see what the algorithm spits out this time. The fact remains that while 23andme might have picked up NA ancestry in me but it did not. My guess is that one must be about 1/64 NA to see any evidence of a minority ancestry otherwise it is going to be a toss up as to whether any minority "shows" or not. I have kin who are much closer generationally to our NA ancestor and can get them tested but with multiple paper sources it is really not necessary - or I can just refer to my ABDNA NA and EA results and make a claim on that basis. A real problem is that in the early 1800's my ancestor's first cousin (a chief of the Tyendinaga Mohawks) was known as John "Blue Eyed" Green - so the family was already well mixed.

                              I trust what 23andme has found. I am happy just knowing what is, not fussing about what this or that means or speculating about mysterious results as is the case with less powerful methodologies which provide unreliable and potentially invalid results.

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