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Can anyone inform me if it is possible to establish via DNA testing - if my materernal grandfather was a native of the South Pacific?
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Re: South Pacific marker?
Hi Chudley,Originally posted by Chudley
Can anyone inform me if it is possible to establish via DNA testing - if my materernal grandfather was a native of the South Pacific?
It's unlikely that you would be able to prove 100% beyond a doubt whether your grandfather was Polynesian. There are two reasons for this, - availability of suitable people to test, and the low chance of any specific Polynesian markers.
Is your Grandfather still alive, I am assuming that he isn't (unless he was adopted & is unsure of his origins). Your grandfather would have been the best person to get tested. If he is no longer alive, then to test you would have to find someone else suitable.
Because he is your maternal grandfather, Your DNA won't give you any answers from either the mtDNA nor Y-markers.
To test using mtDNA, you would need to test a direct maternal line descendant of a sister of your grandfather (ie her daughter or her daughters daugher...).
To test the Y-line, you would need to test either a brother of your grandfather, a maternal uncle, or a son of yur maternal uncle (ie. someone descended along the male line.
If none of those people are available, then the only possible test that could be done is the DNA print test, which you would be able to take. However, whether this would be of any use would depend on the rest of your ancestry (ie. whether you have any Asian or Native American ancestry), and it would not differentiate from Asian (or even some Native American) ancestry.
The genetic markers that are present in Polynesians are broady speaking from the same haplotype marker pool of Asia. For the DNA print test, if your grandfather was 100% polynesian, that would give your DNAprint result something like "25% South East Asian" - so if you have Asian or Native american ancestry then you wouldn't be able to say for sure that any "South east asian" levels were from your grandfather.
I'm not 100% "up to scratch" with the literature on pacific mtDNA & Y-chromosome haplotype subdivisions, so there may be the occasional haplotype subdivision that is not found in mainland Asia but chances are that any result you get is unlikely to be distinguished from a general Asian origin. I might have read that there is a specific marker change in the mtDNA present in some polynesian populations - but i'm not sure if the available mtDNA tests look at that particular area of the DNA.
So, unfortunately, the broad answer to your question is that the chance of proving polynesian ancestry (v's Asian) of your grandfather are low.
Angela.
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Re: Re: South Pacific marker?
Hi again,Originally posted by AngelaCP
I'm not 100% "up to scratch" with the literature on pacific mtDNA & Y-chromosome haplotype subdivisions, so there may be the occasional haplotype subdivision that is not found in mainland Asia but chances are that any result you get is unlikely to be distinguished from a general Asian origin. I might have read that there is a specific marker change in the mtDNA present in some polynesian populations - but i'm not sure if the available mtDNA tests look at that particular area of the DNA.
I've just checked the literature, and there is a mtDNA sequence that is characteristic of Polynesians.
It is within the mtDNA haplogroup B, and the three mutations 217, 247 & 261 are found almost exclusively in Polynesians.
These sequence changes can also be found in a very small number of Indonesians, but in well over 80% of polynesians (in NZ Maori it is about 95%). People in haplotype B without these sequence changes are found throught Asia, and in some Native Americans.
So, .if there is a person available from your grandfathers mtDNA line (himself or a female-line descendant of a sister), then you may be able to find out.
Angela.
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Re: Re: Re: South Pacific marker?
Thank you Angela very much for your time and effort.Originally posted by AngelaCP
Hi again,
I've just checked the literature, and there is a mtDNA sequence that is characteristic of Polynesians.
It is within the mtDNA haplogroup B, and the three mutations 217, 247 & 261 are found almost exclusively in Polynesians.
These sequence changes can also be found in a very small number of Indonesians, but in well over 80% of polynesians (in NZ Maori it is about 95%). People in haplotype B without these sequence changes are found throught Asia, and in some Native Americans.
So, .if there is a person available from your grandfathers mtDNA line (himself or a female-line descendant of a sister), then you may be able to find out.
Angela.
Very little is known for sure - only that my mother was adopted and came from NZ. It is just an assumption that her father was a Maori as it could just as easily been her mother or indeed that there was no Maori blood at all.
There is only me available for testing and as far as I am aware the rest of me is the usual European mix. Would the DNA 'print' test be able to establish if the mtDNA sequence that is characteristic of Polynesians is present in me?Comment
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Re: Re: Re: Re: South Pacific marker?
HI,Originally posted by Chudley
Thank you Angela very much for your time and effort.
Very little is known for sure - only that my mother was adopted and came from NZ. It is just an assumption that her father was a Maori as it could just as easily been her mother or indeed that there was no Maori blood at all.
There is only me available for testing and as far as I am aware the rest of me is the usual European mix. Would the DNA 'print' test be able to establish if the mtDNA sequence that is characteristic of Polynesians is present in me?
Greetings from a New Zealander!
The "DNA print" test won't detect mtDNA, but the mtDNA test does.
MtDNA is different from the rest of our DNA, and is inherited from our mothers only (and their mothers and so on).
You could take the mtDNA test on the off chance that your mothers possible maori ancestor was along the direct female line. Depending on when your mother was born, it may be more likely that any maori ancestor was along the female line.
Before 1965 for instance, in Maori/non Maori couples, it was more likely to be the woman who was Maori. Currently in New Zealand, it is equal. Also, be aware that any Maori ancestor is not neccessarily 100% Maori - intermarriage was and is quite common. With any level of Maori ancestry, a person can be considered Maori.
Also be aware that if you are tested and you find that you do have those mtDNA sequence changes, it might not indicate that the maternal line ancestor was Maori, in the North island, particularly in the Auckland region there are quite large Polynesian island communities. Again, the liklihood of this probably depends on when your mother was born, - the Polynesian island communities have increased in number over time.
If tracking down your mothers adoption records isn't an option, then you could take the mtDNA test, realising that the chance that the possible ancestor was on the female line is probably 40-60%. If you get the result back and find you are in Haplotype B with those three sequence changes (plus any others), then you will be able to conclude for sure that your mother (and you) do have Polynesian ancestry (but not neccessarily Maori).
If when you get your result you find you have a European haplotype, that might mean you have no Maori ancestry, or it might just mean that it wasn't along the female line. If you still want to pursue it you could then take the DNA print test, but any polynesian ancestry would be indistinguishable from "Asian".
Good luck,
Angela.Comment
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: South Pacific marker?
[QUOTE]Originally posted by AngelaCP
[B]HI,
Greetings from a New Zealander!
Sorry I didn't say but I am in the UK. My mother would have been born in the 1920's and came to the UK before WW2. I was born in 1951 and my brother 8 years earlier.
>The "DNA print" test won't detect mtDNA, but the mtDNA test does.<
I know I said that I was the only one to test - but I forgot to say that we do have a daughter. Given your helpful information about relationships prior to 1965 - perhaps she would be the best one to take mtDNA test?Comment
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South Pacific marker?
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chudley
[B]Hi Chudley,Originally posted by AngelaCP
HI,
Greetings from a New Zealander!
Sorry I didn't say but I am in the UK. My mother would have been born in the 1920's and came to the UK before WW2. I was born in 1951 and my brother 8 years earlier.
>The "DNA print" test won't detect mtDNA, but the mtDNA test does.<
I know I said that I was the only one to test - but I forgot to say that we do have a daughter. Given your helpful information about relationships prior to 1965 - perhaps she would be the best one to take mtDNA test?
You would be the best person to be tested.
Angela.
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