A Great Day for the Irish...er, Spanish, maybe Mongul

[mush589]

All right! I don't know what I'm doing here but a map I received showed that my ancesters came from east of Europe, and it seems, mutated a bit along the way to Spain. Somehow they arrived in Ireland. All of which may have had a lot to do to create the Gaelic family name of O'Duinnin which, roughly translated, means "son of the little brown man".

I know my grandfather was born in Preston, Lancashire, England and that the Irish Famine might have sent his father from Ballymona, Cork sometime between his birth (abt 1835) and that tragic event in 1845.

Tim Dineen

[Jim Honeychuck]

Tim,

Y-DNA and mtDNA record your deep ancestry. Your ancestors probably arrived in Ireland several thousand years before there ever was such a thing as a Spaniard or a Mongol.

Regards,

Jim

[mush589]

Yes, maybe, but...

My family group shows R1b1 and follows a parade from Asia through Europe and ends in Spain or Portugal, although none of these places had names at that time, ergo: no postcards.
I understand what you are saying but I may have to be convinced.
Tim

[mush589]

I visited the U of Toronto's Robarts Library and discovered a possible link between my roots in Ireland and Spain. I had not thought there could be a connection in recorded history but Dr. Edmund Curtis book, A History of Ireland, 1952, opens his work with:"The ancient Leabar Gabala (the Book of Invasions) preserves the tradition that three sons os Mileadh of Spain, namely Heremon, Heber, and Ir, conquered Erin (Ireland) about the time of Alexander the Great. From these men descended all the royal clans of later Ireland. To be of the old Milesian race is regarded as an honourable distinction, by those who remember the story of "Meela Spaunya". This all concerns tradition.
The Gaelic Celts came from southern France or Northern Spain about 350 B.C. They eventually became the political masters of Ireland, and though an upper class minority, had, by A.D. 800, imposed their empire, language and law upon the whole of Ireland. In early history tradition and fact are blended together and, not until St. Patrick's arrival in 432, may we regard ourselves on historical ground."
I wonder how many generations I can go through to get to that period...
Tim

[Jim Honeychuck]

Those issues are discussed in Stephen Oppenheimer's 2006 book The Origins of the British (may have a different title in the US and Canada).

The bottom line is that your haplogroup arrived in Ireland long before anything Celtic, and there was no subsequent Celtic invasion.

Your ancestors may have arrived in Ireland from Spain as long ago as 15,000 years, but there is no archaeological evidence older than about 10,000 years ago.

Regards,
Jim

[hdw]

All right! I don't know what I'm doing here but a map I received showed that my ancesters came from east of Europe, and it seems, mutated a bit along the way to Spain. Somehow they arrived in Ireland. All of which may have had a lot to do to create the Gaelic family name of O'Duinnin which, roughly translated, means "son of the little brown man".

I know my grandfather was born in Preston, Lancashire, England and that the Irish Famine might have sent his father from Ballymona, Cork sometime between his birth (abt 1835) and that tragic event in 1845.

Tim Dineen

All or most of us R1b1c people seem to have had ancestors who hung around the Iberian caves keeping warm and dry until the end of the last Ice Age around 10,000 years ago, then the ones with real get-up-and-go got up and went north and west to Ireland, Scotland, Wales and (mostly, the west of) England. I suppose that's why a (formerly) red-haired and freckled Scot like me keeps finding DNA matches with people in Latin America of Spanish and Portuguese descent. However, these matches are of the order of 10/10 and 12/12, not anything bigger than that, which again seems to fit with the theory that our common ancestors were thousands of years ago.

As for DINEEN - speaking as someone who used to help edit a dictionary (of Scots), I've heard of the famous Dineen's Irish Dictionary, which first appeared in 1904. That's a dictionary of Ireland's indigenous Celtic language, Gaelic. Fr. Patrick Dineen was a Catholic priest and scholar who was born in 1860 in Rathmore, 10 miles from Killarney, near the Cork/Kerry border.

In Britain, there's a well-known TV producer and director called Molly Dineen, who was born in Canada in 1959.

A lot of Lancashire people are of Irish descent, and of course the potato famine of the 1840s had a lot to do with it, although I don't think that was the sole cause of emigration. I get the impression that Irish emigration to Lancs. was from the west and south of Ireland, whereas here in Scotland where I live, and particularly in Glasgow and the west generally, the emigration was from Ulster, Donegal and Sligo.

The only Irish ancestors I can lay claim to were Presbyterians of probable Scottish descent from the County Down. My earliest known mtDNA ancestor comes from that branch of my tree.

Harry

[mush589]

Thank you Harry

It is always enjoyable to meet up with a red haired Scat. Mom was from Lanark and raised in Edinborough.
I know of Father Dinneen and met his nephew but, at this time cannot lay any claim to a close relationship. As for Molly, again, not one of ours! There are a number of Dineens and Dinneens here in Canada and in Ontario a grandfather died and had Dineen on one side of his tombstone and Dinneen on the other. They all have a family gathering once a year to discuss the proper spelling.
Thats it for now but I'm so glad to get away from the caves. The snow outside the house is knee deep.
Tim