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R1b Haplotype 35 In The British Isles

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  • #16
    393-12
    390-24
    19--14
    391-10
    385a-11
    385b-14
    426-12
    388-12
    439-12
    389.1-13
    392-13
    389.2-29
    458-18
    459a-9
    459b-10

    I'm classed R1B1 without an SNP test. Should i get one done? What could i learn?

    Comment


    • #17
      I read yesterday on the DNA-Genealogy list that FTDNA will offer a deep subclade test for R1b today. So stay tuned. Keep in mind that the odds are you will only add a "c" to your present R1b1.

      Bill Hurst

      Comment


      • #18
        I did my Y-chromosome DNA test in the Genographic Project and came up with these results of the R1b Haplogroup. I believe I found a French root, and a Germanic/Scandinavian root. Can anyone help me find my origins?

        393=13
        19=15
        391=11
        439=11
        389-1=13
        389-2=16
        388=12
        390=23
        426=12
        385a=11
        385b=12
        392=13

        Comment


        • #19
          The Nordic & Celtic DNA Project

          I have developed a project that is open to both men and women of Nordic and of Celtic Iberian origins. This project is designed to show evidence of deep ancestral patterns found within Celtic Iberians and Scandinavian settlements throughout Europe.

          If you follow the steps below - it shouldn't cost you anything.

          How to Join the Nordic-Celtic Project

          Current Family Tree DNA Customers: Go to your Family Tree DNA personal page and click on the blue icon labelled "Join." (This is next to your name and kit number, at the top of the page.) This will bring you to a page with the title "Group Join." Type "Nordic-Celtic" in the search engine and click to go to a page which will allow you to join the Nordic-Celtic Project.

          Best Regards,
          John

          Website: http://www.familytreedna.com/public/Nordic-Celtic

          Comment


          • #20
            Originally posted by Eald_Folcwiga
            I did my Y-chromosome DNA test in the Genographic Project and came up with these results of the R1b Haplogroup. I believe I found a French root, and a Germanic/Scandinavian root. Can anyone help me find my origins?

            393=13
            19=15
            391=11
            439=11
            389-1=13
            389-2=16
            388=12
            390=23
            426=12
            385a=11
            385b=12
            392=13
            Well, what caught my eye right away was your 23 repeats at 390. That could be an indication that you belong to the R1b-Frisian modal haplotype (a North Sea haplotype common also in Denmark).

            Go to this web site, check out the R1b chart there, and compare your values to the different R1b modals. See which of them fits your markers most closely.

            You are probably going to need to upgrade to at least 37 markers and do a deep SNP, as well, to be sure, but checking that chart is a good start.

            I match the Frisian and Norwegian modals most closely myself, but I am still waiting on markers 26-37, and I also need to do the deep SNP thing.

            Good luck, brother, and welcome!

            Oops! I just noticed that your post was from back in March! You probably know all this stuff by now.
            Last edited by Stevo; 25 May 2006, 07:54 AM.

            Comment


            • #21
              Hello again,
              I found I was Anglo-Saxon R1b, which is marked by DYS390: 23, and DYS391: 11..

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Eald_Folcwiga
                Hello again,
                I found I was Anglo-Saxon R1b, which is marked by DYS390: 23, and DYS391: 11..
                Hey! It's about time you showed up again!

                You know, we have our own R1b Forum. Please come on over there and post some.

                Have you upgraded to 37 markers or had an SNP test yet?

                Comment


                • #23
                  Hello everyone,

                  First of all I`d like to say that I do hope you guys don`t mind me
                  posting some info, eventhough i`m actually from Holland.

                  It`s mainly because after searching on the web for such a long time
                  i suddenly stumbled upon your stories, and realized the simularities
                  between your 12 markers and mine are remarkable. I though to myself :"Every tiny bit of information could be helpful" , so that is the reason why i decided to post my message

                  My Y-DNA Genetic STR Markers > www.ysearch.org ID: AUXRP
                  At this moment only 12 markers, but they`re now testing all 67 markers
                  so... i should have them upcoming October.

                  My Allele Counts
                  DYS 393 : 13
                  DYS 390 : 24
                  DYS 19 : 14
                  DYS 391 : 11
                  DYS 385a : 11
                  DYS 385b : 14
                  DYS 426 : 12
                  DYS 388 : 12
                  DYS 439 : 11
                  DYS 389i : 13
                  DYS 392 : 13
                  DYS 389ii : 29

                  It does look like there is a chance that my
                  ancestor came from The British Isles,
                  so i will be compairing hundreds of people
                  to my STR Markers when i have all 67 markers.

                  It would be awesome if i do have a Celtic origin,
                  FTDNA prediction says i`m probably a R1b1c

                  Hopefully i`ll discover more info in the near future
                  cause I`d love to know where my ancestor came from.

                  Thanks for your time,
                  And good luck to you all !

                  Kind Regards from Holland,
                  Wilbert Verboekend {South Holland}

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Neo Lithic
                    It does look like there is a chance that my
                    ancestor came from The British Isles,
                    so i will be compairing hundreds of people
                    to my STR Markers when i have all 67 markers.
                    We're very happy to hear from you, but frankly, your 12 markers are much too common to draw conclusions from. Look all the way down your list of matches in Ysearch:

                    http://www.ysearch.org/search_result...smatches_max=0

                    Yes, you match plenty of British Isles people, because they are so plentiful in the database, but you also match Poles and Puerto Ricans.

                    In other words, the additional markers you ordered are essential in order to place your deep ancestry. We'll be looking forward to seeing them.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Anyone have any region thoughts about these markers...
                      13 25 14 12 11 14 11 12 11 13 13 29 FTDna sequence

                      FTDna predicts R1b1, Whit Athey 44-R1b /34-Q on 24 markers. (13 - 25 are being retested)
                      deepSNP won't be in for 2 months.

                      Scot

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        My 67 DYS# Markers

                        Hello everyone,

                        Currently FTDNA is still testing the last 2 SNP`s (M37 and SRY 2627)
                        They already confirmed that i`m R1b1c, but the question is
                        what comes after the C. I reacon i`ll eventually end up being R1b1c*
                        because FTDNA doesn`t look for the S21 of S28 mutation.
                        But on the Forum i discovered some messages telling about a possible
                        indicator for R1b1c9 which could be found in the Y=STR DYS# Values.
                        Most people belonging to R1b1c9 have DYS#492=13 and DYS#425=0 ,
                        and these are exactly the same values i have.

                        It`s alot of fun trying to figure out what all this information means,
                        but it`s easier said then done. If i would decide to let EA test my final
                        SNP markers to confirm if i am R1b1c9 or 10 then i would be sure...
                        but i still would be confused if any of my ancestors had a Celtic background
                        long ago. As far as I`ve come to understand it, being Celtic isn`t specifically something which is dependent upon the correct DNA Haplotype, right ?

                        Okey.. below you`ll find my Y-STR DYS Marker Values, all 67 ...
                        Perhaps someone could give me some more information ? we`ll see

                        See Ya Later,
                        Neo

                        DYS# A
                        393 13
                        390 24
                        19 14
                        391 11
                        385a 11
                        385b 14
                        426 12
                        388 12
                        439 11
                        389-1 13
                        392 13
                        389-2 29
                        458 17
                        459a 9
                        459b 10
                        455 11
                        454 11
                        447 24
                        437 14
                        448 19
                        449 30
                        464a 16
                        464b 16
                        464c 16
                        464d 16
                        460 10
                        H4 11
                        YCAII a 19
                        YCAII b 23
                        456 15
                        607 15
                        576 19
                        570 17
                        CDYa 38
                        CDYb 38
                        442 11
                        438 13
                        425 0
                        444 12
                        446 13
                        531 11
                        578 9
                        395S1a 15
                        395S1b 16
                        590 8
                        537 10
                        641 10
                        472 8
                        406S1 10
                        511 11
                        413a 23
                        413b 23
                        557 16
                        594 10
                        436 12
                        490 12
                        534 16
                        450 8
                        481 22
                        520 20
                        617 12
                        568 11
                        487 14
                        572 11
                        640 11
                        492 13
                        565 12

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Neo Lithic
                          Hello everyone,

                          Currently FTDNA is still testing the last 2 SNP`s (M37 and SRY 2627)
                          They already confirmed that i`m R1b1c, but the question is
                          what comes after the C. I reacon i`ll eventually end up being R1b1c*
                          because FTDNA doesn`t look for the S21 of S28 mutation.
                          But on the Forum i discovered some messages telling about a possible
                          indicator for R1b1c9 which could be found in the Y=STR DYS# Values.
                          Most people belonging to R1b1c9 have DYS#492=13 and DYS#425=0 ,
                          and these are exactly the same values i have.

                          It`s alot of fun trying to figure out what all this information means,
                          but it`s easier said then done. If i would decide to let EA test my final
                          SNP markers to confirm if i am R1b1c9 or 10 then i would be sure...
                          but i still would be confused if any of my ancestors had a Celtic background
                          long ago. As far as I`ve come to understand it, being Celtic isn`t specifically something which is dependent upon the correct DNA Haplotype, right ?

                          Okey.. below you`ll find my Y-STR DYS Marker Values, all 67 ...
                          Perhaps someone could give me some more information ? we`ll see

                          See Ya Later,
                          Neo

                          DYS# A
                          393 13
                          390 24
                          19 14
                          391 11
                          385a 11
                          385b 14
                          426 12
                          388 12
                          439 11
                          389-1 13
                          392 13
                          389-2 29
                          458 17
                          459a 9
                          459b 10
                          455 11
                          454 11
                          447 24
                          437 14
                          448 19
                          449 30
                          464a 16
                          464b 16
                          464c 16
                          464d 16
                          460 10
                          H4 11
                          YCAII a 19
                          YCAII b 23
                          456 15
                          607 15
                          576 19
                          570 17
                          CDYa 38
                          CDYb 38
                          442 11
                          438 13
                          425 0
                          444 12
                          446 13
                          531 11
                          578 9
                          395S1a 15
                          395S1b 16
                          590 8
                          537 10
                          641 10
                          472 8
                          406S1 10
                          511 11
                          413a 23
                          413b 23
                          557 16
                          594 10
                          436 12
                          490 12
                          534 16
                          450 8
                          481 22
                          520 20
                          617 12
                          568 11
                          487 14
                          572 11
                          640 11
                          492 13
                          565 12
                          To answer your question about Celtic background first, EA believes that a S21+ result would indicate northern European (the area where the Dutch, Germans, Danish and Norwegians now live) deep ancestry and rule out Celtic ancestry. However, EA believes that S28+ indicates deep ancestry among the La Tene Celts of central Europe. This is a different Celtic group than the ones who settled in the British Isles. These theories are not written in stone and may change as results are gotten from more people with ancestry from throughout Europe.

                          Just a slight correction about the "null 425" value. It's not the case that most S21+ haplotypes are null 425. If you look at the ysearch database of the R1b project, only about 3% of all R1b's have null 425. Looking at the known S21+'s, the figure is slightly higher, about 5%.

                          I too am 492=13 and null 425 and have tested S21+. Since I received my 67 marker upgrade results in August and found I have null 425, I've been investigating what seems to be an S21+ cluster with null 425. So far only myself and another member of this cluster have tested S21+, but it seems there are at least 20 paternal lines in the ysearch database involved in this cluster. There is wide geographical distribution for the ancestry of the cluster members - England, France, Belgium, Germany and Italy for sure. The indications are that it is at least 2,000 years old and possibly as old as 4-5,000 years. It's believed that all its members are S21+.

                          The key marker values for this cluster are:
                          390=23
                          447=24
                          460=10
                          425=null
                          492=13

                          Leaving aside 425, all those values are off from the general R1b modal. Looking at your results, the only one you differ on is 390, where you have 24, the general R1b modal. I think there's a good chance that you're a member of this cluster and your 390 has just mutated from the cluster value.

                          Right now I'm awaiting the results for two of the new advanced tests at FTDNA - DYF371x and DYF408, which are both in the P5 palindromic region of the y chromosome. DYS425 is one of the two markers associated with DYF371 in the P5 region. It's possible the results of these tests will explain why I have a null 425. Another S21+ with null 425, but not a member of this cluster, is also awaiting results for these tests, so we can compare and see if there are any differences. It is possible that there will be no ready explanation for the null 425 from these tests. That brings up the possibility that there is a SNP causing the null 425 result in some S21+'s, which would mean further research to look for it. Of course, that would define a new subclade of R1b1c9.

                          I thought you would be interested in knowning a few of the details. Have you uploaded your full 67 marker results to ysearch? If so, what's your ID? If you haven't uploaded to ysearch, please do, so I can find your haplotype and add it to my spreadsheet of cluster members.

                          Mike Maddi

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Neo Lithic,

                            I found another posting by you in this thread back in September, where you listed your ysearch ID. I see that it's AUXRP.

                            Looking in my spreadsheet, I have you listed as a potential member of the cluster. I don't have you as definite because of your 390=24, but as I mentioned in my previous posting, that may be a mutation in your paternal line from 23. If that's the case, then you're probably a member of the cluster.

                            Mike

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Hi Mike,

                              Thanks for your reply !
                              You`re correct, my ysearch ID is AUXRP

                              Eventhough i`ve learned a lot about Y-DNA these past months
                              since July 2006, i`m still new ... and internet probably does
                              not tell you everything.. and is not always correct. so i`m still learning
                              to work with comparing markers ... and understanding what it`s about.

                              Indeed i`m looking for my Ancestral Origins and that`s also why
                              i`m interested in knowing more about the cluster you were refering to.

                              In any case its good to know that there is probably that DYS#390 mutated
                              from 23 to 24, in my case apparently.

                              I also compared all your Y-STR markers with those i have, and there are
                              a lot of simularities.

                              I just started scratching the surface looking into all this data, and trying to collect as much information as i can so i can understand it, but it`ll take a while before i have enough to chew on.

                              But you`ve already been very helpfull,
                              thank you very much.

                              See Ya later,
                              Kind Regards, Neo *

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                I have 460 = 10 and 390 = 23 and 492 =13. I took the FTDNA deep clade test, and ended up "R1b1c?" with a bunch of negatives. I can remember when all Y-DNA of human males were the same. So, I think we are just beginning to understand how to classify the Y-DNA. I hate this not knowing (Scotty TOS). Still, we must learn to wait some times.

                                Comment

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