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Mtdna and Ydna together?

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  • Mtdna and Ydna together?

    I am going to order the test finally and want to do it when I visit my brother in a few weeks. I am mainly interested in knowing the haplogroups and other general stuff...not really looking for lost family.

    I wonder if we should just take the samples on my brother for both male and female lines and use the combined test.
    Also wondering how long it takes to get the test kit once ordered. I live in Ontario, Canada.


    Thanks,


    A

  • #2
    Arimas:

    I don't think FTDNA offers particular discounts for testing both together- but this should be checked. It seems it's still cheaper to go via the genographic project at the national geographic, which goes for $99 each. At this point, I guess I would test test your mtdna and your brother's Y separately this way.

    Also, for your brother, make sure that the 12 marker test you do also guarantees that they will specify the haplogroup. This is especially important for Africans (and from little studied areas like Eastern Africa), because the STR may be quite different from what they have in their dataset. I think the genographic project guarantees this, I am not sure about what happens if one orders directly through FTDNA.

    If you are willing to pay and are interested, you may want to consider the full mtdna (rather than just HVR1), which goes for $500 at FTDNA and $450 at Argusbio.com (I tested with the latter). The reason is that African mtdna is still being studied and subgroups are still being defined and made precise. If you have the whole mtdna, you can place yourself more clearly within the L0-L3 family, and if something new comes out later, you will be able to see if you happen to fit there. Of course, the whole mtdna costs quite a bit more than the basic test.

    cacio

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Arimas
      I wonder if we should just take the samples on my brother for both male and female lines and use the combined test.
      Also wondering how long it takes to get the test kit once ordered. I live in Ontario, Canada.
      Assuming that you order through a project, you do save money by testing both yDNA and mtDNA of one person. The more testing you specify in the initial order, the more you save.

      Let's say that you test your brother only to the same extent that the Genographic Project would. In FTDNA terms, that would be Y-DNA12+mtDNA, which costs $199 plus $2 shipping. Ordering through the Genographic Project would cost, I think, 2 x $99 + $7.50 shipping. Moreover, FTDNA's price includes at least one certificate, possibly two (one for yDNA, one for mtDNA?).

      If you specify more testing on that initial order, you save even more. The best bargain is Y-DNA67+mtDNAPlus for $409 + $2 shipping. It includes 67 yDNA markers (and a free haplogroup test if necessary), plus testing of both HVR1 and HVR2 of the mtDNA. Piecemeal, such testing would cost close to $500.

      Or if you can afford it, go for the SuperDNA test, which includes full mtDNA sequencing. If you think you will eventually want full mtDNA sequencing anyway, it makes great sense to order it right away instead of throwing away money on lesser mtDNA tests.

      FTDNA's yDNA testing now includes the same haplogroup classification guarantee that the Genographic Project provides:

      http://www.ftdna.com/SNP_assurance.html

      Indeed, FTDNA's haplogroup classifications are usually more specific than Genographic's. For example, Genographic may classify you merely into haplogroup I, whereas FTDNA will generally specify I1a, I1b, etc.

      But once again, to get the best price, you must pre-join a project, either surname or geographical (e.g., 'African'):

      http://www.ftdna.com/surname.aspx

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Arimas
        I am mainly interested in knowing the haplogroups and other general stuff...not really looking for lost family.
        Sometimes finding DNA matches can reveal more information than a typical haplogroup description. FTDNA will match you with people who share your markers. In my case, I got a recent match with someone who is from the same state and Indian tribe as my grandmother. This confirmed things. I never would have found this information by knowing my haplogroup alone.

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks

          Thanks Cacio, Igmayka and Haplogroupc.

          At this point I am only interested in knowing the minimum and yes, I want to make sure I learn what is the haplogroup.

          I know my family tree pretty well and we lived in the same region (between 2-3 countries) for generations... I actually have more distant cousins that I could care for. I am more interested in learning more about my roots from 20 generations earlier if that's possible than knowing who is my 7 or 10th cousin.

          Maybe it isn't important but I have trouble answering the question of which race I belong to. Now, as Americans you can say you are half this and 1/4 that etc. but I can't...say something like that. So even though, it is not a big identity problem (I know who are/were my parents and which family I come from), it is a small one.


          Igmayka, what can I learned from a full Mtdna and how can it help me knowing my distant roots? Wouldn't it help me more to find out more about my dad's mother side (through my aunt) who was from a different area/tribe?

          Haplogroupc, have you found your grandma distant "cousin" just with the 12 markers or you did more markers?

          Cacio, I don't think they will find anyone close to me in the database. I must be unique thanks for the advice.

          Comment


          • #6
            Arimas:

            As a likely birthplace of modern humans, East Africa shares the deepest Y and mtdna lineages, as well as most standard African ones, and the Middle Eastern too. So I guess the concept of race (if it ever makes sense) is quite complicated there!

            It seems a good idea to me too that if you have access to the relevant people, you may get more information by testing 5 or 6 people along the different family lines, rather than just doing very deep tests for your brother.

            My comment about full mtdna referred to the fact that going to the full mtdna does add a lot of information to the simple HVR1 study. This is because most mtdna lineages are defined by coding region mutations, that is, mutations outside HVR. To make an example, HVR1 could tell you that you are L3, but this doesn't say much because L3 is spread throughout Africa. A deeper test could tell you L3a, L3b etc., which may have a slightly more localized distribution. Moreover, new branches and twigs of the African mtdna are being discovered, so you may belong to a branch that has not been defined yet.

            Said that, for a given budget, I would also rather test more people than go deeper. And in any case, even though that is not cost-efficient, you can always see what the basic test says, and then, given the result, decide to test more later on.

            cacio

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Arimas
              Haplogroupc, have you found your grandma distant "cousin" just with the 12 markers or you did more markers?
              It was the mtDNA HVR1 and HVR2. I have several matches in HVR1 and HVR2 and it's significant for me because my markers seem odd. I have a marker that I don't commonly see in Mexican samples.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Arimas
                Igmayka, what can I learned from a full Mtdna and how can it help me knowing my distant roots? Wouldn't it help me more to find out more about my dad's mother side (through my aunt) who was from a different area/tribe?
                I agree with cacio that for a given budget, and if your primary goal is to understand your total genetic inheritance, your best approach is to test (shallowly, if necessary) as many different ancestral lines as possible. After you get several 'shallow' results, you can decide which ones warrant 'deeper' testing.

                It is also very important to get DNA samples from elderly relatives before their lineages die out or 'daughter out'.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Thank you so much Cacio, Haplogroupc and Igmayka.

                  I will follow your suggestions and progressively test more people...just hope that I will have the time and the access to all of them because we don't all live in the same place.

                  The other thing is we don't have surnames that can help with genealogy like in Western/European tradition but we have clan and tribe names. Most of us have our family trees written down or know them orally...but the family trees don't go further than 15-20 generations. I suspect in that part of East-Africa people lived isolated and intermarried with other clan/tribe members for the last 2-300 years.

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