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NEW ! -J2 Y DNA project update
Hello forum members,
This post is to announce the latest J2 Y-DNA project analysis update
(if you use internet explorer 7 you might want to visit this page first :
http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/ie7.html )
a) A new network diagram analysis has been done, adding 28 additional haplotypes . The positions of some of the clusters have altered as a result of these new additions. For the 37 marker analysis, separate analyses for J2a and J2b haplotypes are now done.
b) An update to our hypotheses on J2b-Delta has been added.
c) Our initial review of the Cruciani et al. 2007 paper has been added.
d) We have added some useful new pages to the site:
i A "frequently asked questions" page.
ii A page that outlines the scientific method
iii A page that outlines which clusters appear to be correlated with Jewish ancestry
iv An analysis updates page
e) In the next few months we hope to begin updating the second phase analysis, and when that is completed we will then revise the third phase analysis. After that is completed, we hope the project will have sufficient data to conclusively answer the projects initial research question. ("Can STR results be used to reliably predict sub-clade in haplogroup J2"). When we make our final conclusions, these will be presented in an unrestricted format.
f) In the new "Updates" page we outline which markers that have not yet been included in the phase two analysis, appear to be very useful for predicting sub-clade.
We also wish to reiterate that the project endeavours to present its results in a scientific manner. At times we may describe our results as being not yet conclusive - this is because research is an ongoing process, - and in the proper practise of scientific research an observation and/or finding is not stated as a fact until it has been rigorously tested according to the scientific method. Proper scientific research takes time.
See our outline of the scientific method:
We won't be monitoring the forum postings, so any comments should be made to the project directly.
We'll now expand on some of the information we present at this project analysis update.
b) We've added an update to our hypotheses on J2b Delta.
We still don't have sufficient concrete evidence to either confirm or refute the hypotheses, - but we do have further anecdotal evidence in support of the hypotheses. The project now has more members that are within J2b-Zita, which we now suspect isn't within J2b-Delta (but we do not yet have concrete evidence for this to be conclusive). We also compare the relative proportions of the different clades within different areas in the British Isles, and also compare this to the relative proportions of the clades within Italy (to examine the common hypothesis of Roman soldiers introducing haplogroup J2 to the British Isles). We conclude that it is more likely that J2 was introduced into the British isles on more than one population movement.
c) http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/analys...ruciani_review
We summarise that the Cruciani et al. 2007 paper suggests that much of the J2b in Europe dates from a Demographic expansion in the Balkan Bronze age. We compare this coalescence age with the coalescence age of J2b in India, and conclude that neither the J2b in Europe and India are derived from each other, and are both derived from an as yet unidentified source population. We hypothesise that differing demographic factors have impacted on microsatellite (ie. STR) and phylogenetic variation in the two populations in different ways. We also conclude that the progenitor of the J2b lineage must have lived far earlier than the Bronze age expansion of J2b from the Balkans, ie. logic dictates that the original progenitor of the lineage that is represented by J2b today, dates from the time that J2a and J2b diverged (which isn't necessarily the time at which the M12 arose).
d) We hope that some of the misconceptions about the project will be clarified with the addition of the first two new pages:
i. "Frequently asked questions" http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/faq.html
ii In this page we outline of the scientific method, and distinguish between science and pseudo science.
iii. In this page we identify which clusters (that were identified in the February phase three cluster analysis) appear to be correlated with Jewish ancestry. These clusters are: J2a-Sigma, J2a-Phi, J2a-Theta, and a previously undefined cluster that we will be calling J2a-Epsilon
iv. In this page we will from now on outline at each update the main findings released at each project update.
On this page, we outline much of which is being outlined in this posting, and also state that we hope to update the phase two analysis in the next few months. In this future update we'll include the new 38-67 FTDNA markers, and also some of the markers tested by DNA heritage/Relative genetics. Of these markers that will be included, we outline which appear to be good candidates for predicting subclade.
- DYS 578 appears to be very useful for distinguishing between J2a and J2b (J2a's usually have values of 7, and J2b's have values of 8)
- DYS 395s1a appears to be very useful for distinguishing J2a M67+ (all have values of 15, 15, and there's only one known J2a M67- that has these values (most J2a M67- have values of 14,15).
- DYS 450 appears to be useful for distinguishing the hypothetical J2-Beta cluster
- DYS 445 appears to be useful for distinguishing the hypothetical J2-Lambda cluster, and also for distinguishing J2-Beta (xJ2 Lambda).
Further links:
Introductory page to projects results
Phase 2 analysis - Marker values in J2 subclades (4 July 2006)
- results for markers 1-12 http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/J2markeralles_1st12.html
- results for markers 13-21 http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/J2mark...condpanel.html
- results for markers 26-37 http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/J2mark...hirdpanel.html
Phase 3 analysis - Cluster analysis (February 2007)
Regards,
Costa. Tsirigakis - Founder & Admin J2 Y DNA project
Angela Cone - Co-Admin
This post is to announce the latest J2 Y-DNA project analysis update
(if you use internet explorer 7 you might want to visit this page first :
http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/ie7.html )
a) A new network diagram analysis has been done, adding 28 additional haplotypes . The positions of some of the clusters have altered as a result of these new additions. For the 37 marker analysis, separate analyses for J2a and J2b haplotypes are now done.
b) An update to our hypotheses on J2b-Delta has been added.
c) Our initial review of the Cruciani et al. 2007 paper has been added.
d) We have added some useful new pages to the site:
i A "frequently asked questions" page.
ii A page that outlines the scientific method
iii A page that outlines which clusters appear to be correlated with Jewish ancestry
iv An analysis updates page
e) In the next few months we hope to begin updating the second phase analysis, and when that is completed we will then revise the third phase analysis. After that is completed, we hope the project will have sufficient data to conclusively answer the projects initial research question. ("Can STR results be used to reliably predict sub-clade in haplogroup J2"). When we make our final conclusions, these will be presented in an unrestricted format.
f) In the new "Updates" page we outline which markers that have not yet been included in the phase two analysis, appear to be very useful for predicting sub-clade.
We also wish to reiterate that the project endeavours to present its results in a scientific manner. At times we may describe our results as being not yet conclusive - this is because research is an ongoing process, - and in the proper practise of scientific research an observation and/or finding is not stated as a fact until it has been rigorously tested according to the scientific method. Proper scientific research takes time.
See our outline of the scientific method:
We won't be monitoring the forum postings, so any comments should be made to the project directly.
We'll now expand on some of the information we present at this project analysis update.
b) We've added an update to our hypotheses on J2b Delta.
We still don't have sufficient concrete evidence to either confirm or refute the hypotheses, - but we do have further anecdotal evidence in support of the hypotheses. The project now has more members that are within J2b-Zita, which we now suspect isn't within J2b-Delta (but we do not yet have concrete evidence for this to be conclusive). We also compare the relative proportions of the different clades within different areas in the British Isles, and also compare this to the relative proportions of the clades within Italy (to examine the common hypothesis of Roman soldiers introducing haplogroup J2 to the British Isles). We conclude that it is more likely that J2 was introduced into the British isles on more than one population movement.
c) http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/analys...ruciani_review
We summarise that the Cruciani et al. 2007 paper suggests that much of the J2b in Europe dates from a Demographic expansion in the Balkan Bronze age. We compare this coalescence age with the coalescence age of J2b in India, and conclude that neither the J2b in Europe and India are derived from each other, and are both derived from an as yet unidentified source population. We hypothesise that differing demographic factors have impacted on microsatellite (ie. STR) and phylogenetic variation in the two populations in different ways. We also conclude that the progenitor of the J2b lineage must have lived far earlier than the Bronze age expansion of J2b from the Balkans, ie. logic dictates that the original progenitor of the lineage that is represented by J2b today, dates from the time that J2a and J2b diverged (which isn't necessarily the time at which the M12 arose).
d) We hope that some of the misconceptions about the project will be clarified with the addition of the first two new pages:
i. "Frequently asked questions" http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/faq.html
ii In this page we outline of the scientific method, and distinguish between science and pseudo science.
iii. In this page we identify which clusters (that were identified in the February phase three cluster analysis) appear to be correlated with Jewish ancestry. These clusters are: J2a-Sigma, J2a-Phi, J2a-Theta, and a previously undefined cluster that we will be calling J2a-Epsilon
iv. In this page we will from now on outline at each update the main findings released at each project update.
On this page, we outline much of which is being outlined in this posting, and also state that we hope to update the phase two analysis in the next few months. In this future update we'll include the new 38-67 FTDNA markers, and also some of the markers tested by DNA heritage/Relative genetics. Of these markers that will be included, we outline which appear to be good candidates for predicting subclade.
- DYS 578 appears to be very useful for distinguishing between J2a and J2b (J2a's usually have values of 7, and J2b's have values of 8)
- DYS 395s1a appears to be very useful for distinguishing J2a M67+ (all have values of 15, 15, and there's only one known J2a M67- that has these values (most J2a M67- have values of 14,15).
- DYS 450 appears to be useful for distinguishing the hypothetical J2-Beta cluster
- DYS 445 appears to be useful for distinguishing the hypothetical J2-Lambda cluster, and also for distinguishing J2-Beta (xJ2 Lambda).
Further links:
Introductory page to projects results
Phase 2 analysis - Marker values in J2 subclades (4 July 2006)
- results for markers 1-12 http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/J2markeralles_1st12.html
- results for markers 13-21 http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/J2mark...condpanel.html
- results for markers 26-37 http://www.j2-ydnaproject.org/J2mark...hirdpanel.html
Phase 3 analysis - Cluster analysis (February 2007)
Regards,
Costa. Tsirigakis - Founder & Admin J2 Y DNA project
Angela Cone - Co-Admin