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Will AncestryDNA data remain after a "Transfer Y-DNA46 with Y-DNA37 Upgrade"?

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  • Will AncestryDNA data remain after a "Transfer Y-DNA46 with Y-DNA37 Upgrade"?

    I started with FTDNA in September 2016 by doing an autosomal transfer of my AncestryDNA v1 data. (See Link #1 below.) That data contained chromosomes numbered 1 through 25, where 23 was X, 24 was Y, and 25 was "pseudoautosomal regions of X and Y". In February 2017 I paid to unlock Family Finder for that data. I have received many good DNA matches from Family Finder since then. That data is stored in an FTDNA account that was assigned a Kit Number B130203, although no physical kit was involved.

    In an attempt to get more information about my paternal line, I ordered the FTDNA feature "Transfer Y-DNA46 + Y-DNA37" a few days ago. (See Link #2 below.)

    I have just now (January 2019) sent a physical sample of my DNA to FTDNA under that program. The sample was prelabeled with the same Kit Number I used for the AncestryDNA data: B130203.

    Here's my question: What DNA data will be stored on FTDNA under Kit Number B130203 after that January 2019 sample is processed? Will it be a mixture of my AncestryDNA data and my FTDNA data, or will all my AncestryDNA data be replaced by the FTDNA data? Will the final result contain both autosomal and Y-DNA data?

    Link #1: Autosomal transfer: https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/...nsfer-program/

    Link #2: Y-DNA transfer: https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/...nsfer-program/
    Last edited by wdfarmer; 4th January 2019, 02:22 AM.

  • #2
    B130203 will contain your transferred autosomal DNA in Family Finder. It will contain your transferred Y-DNA. The sample you provided will be used to extract the missing Y-DNA STR markers to bring your kit up to FTDNA's normal set of markers and to predict your Y-DNA Haplogroup. It will also be use for any additional Y-DNA or mtDNA testing you select.

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    • #3
      Thank you, Jim, for that excellent answer. I do find the name of the upgrade I ordered a bit confusing; why is it called "Transfer Y-DNA46 with Y-DNA37 Upgrade"? Is the Y-DNA result going to be the same as if I had not transferred my AncestryDNA and originally tested at the Y-DNA46 level (if such an FTDNA product existed)?

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      • #4
        Ancestry sold Y-DNA33 and Y-DNA46 test, but they did not include the same markers that FTDNA includes in their Y-DNA25 and Y-DNA37 marker kits. The "Transfer Y-DNA46 with Y-DNA37 Upgrade" fills in the missing STR markers that FTDNA includes in their Y-DNA37 test that Ancestry did not include in their Y-DNA46 marker test.

        To have every STR marker Ancestry included in their 46 marker test you have to have FTDNA's 111 test. One example is marker DYS461 which is in position 33 of Ancestry's report is in position 110 of FTDNA's report.

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        • #5
          I understand. When I ordered my AncestryDNA kit on 14 Aug 2015, I ordered their autosomal test; I don't recall whether they were offering Y-DNA33 and Y-DNA46 testing at the time.

          My AncestryDNA autosomal test's raw data for the Y chromosome is comprised of just 885 SNPs, which is only 5% of the 17604 SNPs they list for the X chromosome. So for Y-DNA analysis, FTDNA doesn't have much to work with without getting a new sample from me, correct?
          Last edited by wdfarmer; 5th January 2019, 12:48 PM.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by wdfarmer View Post
            I understand. When I ordered my AncestryDNA kit on 14 Aug 2015, I ordered their autosomal test; I don't recall whether they were offering Y-DNA33 and Y-DNA46 testing at the time.

            My AncestryDNA autosomal test's raw data for the Y chromosome is comprised of just 885 SNPs, which is only 5% of the 17604 SNPs they list for the X chromosome. So for Y-DNA analysis, FTDNA doesn't have much to work with without getting a new sample from me, correct?
            Jim Barrett must be misunderstanding your question. There is not enough data (or even the correct data) in your autosomal transfer from Ancestry for Y-Chromosome matching here at FTDNA. The Y-DNA transfer link you refer to is not for you, that link is only for those who tested using the old Ancestry Y-DNA tests that haven't been sold by Ancestry in years. If you want to do testing on your paternal line you will have to purchase a Y-DNA test directly through FTDNA. Please contact customer support and tell them you made a mistake in ordering the Y-DNA transfer. Maybe they can correct it and change it so you can order the correct Y-DNA test.

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            • #7
              You may be correct, travers, but I think I'll wait and see whether FTDNA is able to process the transfer that I purchased. It was the one that FTDNA customer support recommended in a chat with me, and since I only paid $58 for it, it would be quite a bargain if they were able to produce a Y-DNA 46 or a Y-DNA 33 profile for me at that price from the new sample I've just sent them.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by travers View Post

                Jim Barrett must be misunderstanding your question. There is not enough data (or even the correct data) in your autosomal transfer from Ancestry for Y-Chromosome matching here at FTDNA. The Y-DNA transfer link you refer to is not for you, that link is only for those who tested using the old Ancestry Y-DNA tests that haven't been sold by Ancestry in years. If you want to do testing on your paternal line you will have to purchase a Y-DNA test directly through FTDNA. Please contact customer support and tell them you made a mistake in ordering the Y-DNA transfer. Maybe they can correct it and change it so you can order the correct Y-DNA test.
                In the OP's original post he said, "In an attempt to get more information about my paternal line, I ordered the FTDNA feature "Transfer Y-DNA46 + Y-DNA37" a few days ago. (See Link #2 below.)". To successfully order this transfer he had to have Y-DNA46 from somewhere. Therefore I ASSUMED he did. If he didn't he can ignore all of my comments.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by wdfarmer View Post
                  You may be correct, travers, but I think I'll wait and see whether FTDNA is able to process the transfer that I purchased. It was the one that FTDNA customer support recommended in a chat with me, and since I only paid $58 for it, it would be quite a bargain if they were able to produce a Y-DNA 46 or a Y-DNA 33 profile for me at that price from the new sample I've just sent them.
                  Yes a bargain that I doubt will work for you. Meanwhile the Holiday sale on their Y-DNA tests has just ended. If you list all the DNA tests you have done in the past we would be able to help you more to see if the transfer is an option for you. If the only previous DNA test you have done is the AncestryDNA autosomal test the transfer option will not work as you need 46 DNA already tested markers to be able to provide FTDNA. AncestryDNA autosomal doesn't test those markers as they test SNPs and these are STRs.

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                  • #10
                    travers, as you suspected, FTDNA was not able to process the transfer. In a 2019-01-11 e-mail to me they said:

                    Dear Kit Manager,

                    We are contacting you regarding kit B130203. The test ordered on this account is a Y DNA Transfer. We have received the samples, however, since there is no transferred Y DNA data, the test is unable to be completed.

                    We accept Y DNA transfers from Ancestry, SMGF, and Genetree. All three companies stopped selling their Y DNA tests in 2013.

                    [...]

                    If you have not taken a Y DNA test with one of those companies, we will need to cancel the Y DNA Transfer, as you do not have Y DNA data to transfer in.

                    We can cancel the Y DNA Transfer, and order the Y37 test that will give you a complete Y DNA test that can be used for the group projects and DNA matching. We can put the $58 you paid for the Y DNA Transfer towards the cost of that test, which is $169. Please confirm you would like to do this, and I will correct your order and send you a link to pay the remaining balance of $111.
                    So, my question is whether the Y37 test would be of value to me. FTDNA seems to downplay that test, saying at https://www.familytreedna.com/products/y-dna#/compare that:

                    If you are looking to begin Y-DNA testing, the Y-37 Marker test will allow you to become familiar with Y-DNA results. However, if you want to know more about your paternal line through matching or participate in any of our free Group Projects, you will want to start with a Y-67 test.
                    Now, I've already run my AncestryDNA data through Promethease and MorleyDNA ( https://ytree.morleydna.com/extractFromAutosomal ), and those claim that my Y-DNA haplogroup is R1b-M405 / S21 / U106. That gives me something to help me in my parental line matching. In addition, the MorleyDNA site has given me a Y-SNP list (attached).

                    Would paying the $169 total to FTDNA for the Y-37 test really give me substantially more help in finding the identity of my paternal great-grandfather and his ancestors? I really can't afford the Y-67 test at this time.
                    Attached Files
                    Last edited by wdfarmer; 16th January 2019, 11:24 PM.

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                    • #11
                      The answer is "it depends" on a number of variables, and it will likely vary from family line to family line,and between haplogroups. That said, 37 marker matches can be misleading in some cases, in that the 37 marker match turns out to have MRCA of 2000+ years ago while your closer cousins fall outside of the filtering criteria at 37 markers. If they're still a close match at 67/111 markers there probably is a relationship within the past several centuries, but still may fall out of bounds. SNP marker tests are the only way to be sure, and deep STR testing is the better way to narrow the field.

                      Both STR convergence and divergence is a highly aggravating thing to work through.

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