Tribes scores

[Kathleen Carrow]

Limited data for D2 and D19 on Omnipop and always at the foot of results page - scroll down past many zeros - !3 populations covered.

I made a tentative attribution of alleles to parents based on these limited results. Ashkenazi are not covered for D2 & 19 but, according to Tribes, Ashkenazi have affinities with Balkans and Eastern Europeans who are represented in these samples by Podlasie Poles, Byelorussians, Serbians, and Kosovo Albanians. MN Native Americans are covered for D2 &19, and while I have reservations about using Native American data as determinative, even when I let Ashkenazi-like matches determine the outcome, with the default going to NA, the attributions hold.

Then I tested the attributions on ENFSI.

Is that my marker value or yours?..yours I guess..I do not know if I have Ashkenazi..never been told that..My Brother in law's folks are Ashkenzai from Belarus and Krakow..c. 1920s.

[tomcat]

Top Twentyone on Omnipop 9 Green Cell. All E+10:
Apache 1.14
Mozabites 2.67
Egyptian 2.91
Karan 4.04
PBSO/BCWP Native American 5.02
Trinidad African American 5.56
Berbers of Morocco 5.73
CA Hispanic 6.03
Basque 6.94
CT Hispanic 7.58
Golla 8.04
Paraguayan 8.24
Khandayat 8.30
FBI Hispanic 9.00
Mexican 9.14
AZ Hispanic 9.35
North & Central Moroccan Berber 9.51
Moroccan Arabs 9.51
NCSBI/CMPD Hispanic 9.64
Moroccan Arabs 9.51
Maghreb 9.76

Kat,

Lots of North African matches here, from top to bottom, beginning with Mozabites and Egyptians. That ancestry is a component of all the 'Hispanic' matches including Paraguayan and Mexican. Another component of 'Hispanic' is Native American and that is seen in the Apache and Palm Beach Sheriff's Office/BCWP Native matches. The AZ-CA Hispanic matches and Mexican are the right geography for Apache.

Also of interest is the Trinidad African-American match as Trinidadians have a South Asian ancestral component and that is also seen in the South Asian matches to Karan, Golla and Khandayat.

Does any of this look familiar to you when you look in the mirror?
Have you had a Tribes analysis done? What do they say?
I don't know what any of this means but I do find this list of matches internally consistent.

[tomcat]

Would really appreciate comments ,input , I have a lot of Basque country ,Spain & Italy & Hispanic in my official Tribes results.,ONE Caucasian result. I do look more Euro ( French ?) than British. Thank you in advance , KAT.

Top Ten on ENFSI, all E-13:

Portugal 7.6037
France/Toulouse 6.6121
Ireland 5.3914
Germany 5.2843
Scotland/Dundee 4.4575
Switzerland 4.0036
Italy 3.6510
Slovenia 3.2047
Sweden 3.1435
Scotland/Glasgow 3.0001

Kat,

There is certainly French in your ENFSI results and Toulouse is more Mediterranean than Lille. And, insofar are there are no population stats for French-Indian or Metis your Omnipop Hispanic matches could be a stand-in for that mix. Or vice-versa, that the ENFSI Mediterranean French is a mis-readng of your Hispanic due to the lack American mixed-race stats in the Euro db. Question mark. But if that were the case one would still expect a better-scoring ENFSI match to Spain.

Seems your Tribes report is in better agreement with Omnipop.

Have you done the Ancestry by DNA 2.5 test? Does your MtDNA hg cast any light? Where were you born and have you tried to get your original birth certificate or release of non-identifying information?

[tomcat]

Although we have yet to do a synchronized update, here are tallies of recent family Tribes World Region scores. Five full siblings from a Ukrainian Jewish father and an admixed Native American mother.

Average - Region - Score-range

23.55 - Northwest Europe - 69.11-4.54
22.41 - Mediterranean - 44.21-4.97
16.99 - Eastern Europe - 42.72-5.40
12.59 - Finno-Ugric - 39.94-3.70
10.25 - Asia Minor - 18.88-3.75
9.410 - North Africa - 31.00-2.00
5.330 - Arab - 14.99-1.40
4.820 - Mestizo - 11.77-1.60
1.250 - India - 2.05-0.50

The score-range is dramatic although the list of regions is very consistent. (There was one Basque score at 2.2 from before the elimination of that region, and one of the minor Indian scores was to North India). I think this points out the importance of testing more than one family member if one wants a proper impression of family ancestry.

[kat]

Re Scores

Hello ; Tom ,thank you very much for your comments ! I guess I should put the results on the X thread. I m adopted ,no info of any sort on the paternal side , & very little forthcoming from my maternal aunt ! My DNA Print EURO 1.0 results are 50 % Northern Euro , 35 % Southern Euro , 10 % Asian ,5 % Middle -eastern ,I wondered if the last two were noise ,but a very knowledgable fellow on the FamilytreeDna Rootsweb discussion list felt that the graphs indicated this was not the case. I am asked often where my ancestors originated. I think the maternal side is probably British ,but the paternal side is a complete mystery.Sorry to have such a long post, thank you ,KAT.

[burto]

Hi Kat,
Who was the guy you showed your Euro test to? I'd like him to have a look at my Mum's scores. What did you get for the Ancestry 2.5 test? Anything other than Indo-European?
Thanks.

[kat]

EURO TEST - test

Hi Burto; Re the graph expert on FT Rootsweb, Ill see if I can find the e-mail ,it was a long time ago.KAT.

[kat]

EURO TEST test

Hi Burto ; The FamilyTree dna Rootsweb fellow s name is John Chandler .Do you access that discussion site ? I m sorry I dont have his e-mail ,you could ask for him on the site ,& send the graphs to him,that s what I did. KAT.

[Sonia]

Small % Sub-Saharan African

Kelly,
My Ancestry by DNA test also showed a small amount of Sub-Sah. African (5%). Like yours, my Tribes test did not return results for any S-S Afric. country. Again, like you, I also received a fairly strong score for Mestizo in World Region Match. DNA Tribes defines "Mestizo" as Native American blended with European and African. So I think that my Mestizo result is reflecting my small percentage of African ancestry.
Did you suspect that you had any African ancestry before your Ancestry by DNA test? Mine was a complete surprise. My other results were: 85% Euro, 5% Native Amer., 5% East Asian, 5% Sub-Sah. African. Since some of my percentages are pretty small and possibly invalid, I'm planning to retake the Ancestry by DNA test when 3.0 (or whatever the next version is called) comes out.
Judy

Hi Kelly & Judy,

I think it would be unlikely for a Tribes Report to pick up on your SSA, given the low percentages. Tribes doesn't do well with admixture. My Gram's ABD2.5 was 82% SSA & 18% E. As Tribes tweeks the algorithm (and adds more African populations) her African ancestry is starting to emerge on her results. Mom's biodad was white and her ABD2.5 is 66% E & 34% SSA - so we're seeing even weaker SSA results. My dad was also a very admixed African American, so the reports are weakest with SSA for my bro, sis, & me.

[Sonia]

Trinidad+Asian Time Frame?

...snip

Also of interest is the Trinidad African-American match as Trinidadians have a South Asian ancestral component and that is also seen in the South Asian matches to Karan, Golla and Khandayat.

snip...

Tom,

When Gram's Tribes first came out unusually East Indian / Chinese, someone noted that there was an East Indian immigration towards the islands in the 1840s. Have you seen anything earlier? Our oldest known direct female ancestor was b. ca 1840 in SC.

TIA

[Sonia]

Basic tutorial?

I wonder what makes the difference, I have made several runs trough structure 2.1 now both assuming independent alleles and correlated alleles but the result clearly put me with a probability over 90% that I do belong to the Caucasian group, the other tree group affiliation is close to 0.

Tom, as I remember you had some high NA scores in ABDNA, if will try to look for you codis alleles if you have posted them to see if there is any affiliation using this method.

Noaide

Hi Noaide,

Do you think it will be possible for basic computer users to ever figure out how to do what you're doing with Structure? If not, when you get a chance, if I send you Gram's values would you run them to see if the affiliation holds for the African American group (ABD2.5 82% SSA / 18%E)?
TIA,

[kat]

Euro Test 2.5 ?

Hi Burto ; I believe I did the 2.0 Euro , & tested 91 % European & 9 % South-Asian. EURO 1.0 was North. European 50 % ,Southern European ( ? Mediterranean ? ) 35 % , South-Asian 10 % ,Middle-Eastern 5 % , KAT.

[burto]

Hi Kat,
The Euro 1.0 is an add on to the AncestrybyDNA 2.0 or newer 2.5 test. It's also the only test that shows South Asian, so maybe you got 9% East Asian for the AncestrybyDNA 2.0 test?
My Mum did the 2.5 version and got 89% European 11% East Asian, so took the Euro 1.0 test and got 65% NW European 13% Med 0% Middle Eastern and 22% South Asian.
I watched a show here in UK called "so you think you're English?" and they tested several random people. According to them a typical English person should get 60% NW European 40% Med, not sure if this helps analyse your results.
2 people got around 18% South Asian and one got 25%, which makes me wonder if there was quite a mixing of Roma with the English?
Only one person got 11% East Asian 5% Native American and they had no known US ancestors. The analyst said this was from Ghenghis invading Eastern Europe. What they didn't say was whether this person had any Eastern European ancestry.
I can't find that chap on where you said...any idea on thread names?

[kat]

East-Asian ,South-Asian ?

Hi Burto; You are right ,the AncestrybyDNA the first test I took measured me at 9 % East-Asian ,not South -Asian , & the EURO 1.0 measured me at 10% South-Asian . Your reference to most English -NW Euro being 60 % & a percentage of another group is not what is stated on the Ancestry by DNA ,( on the earlier site ) most English people will have a result of 75-80 % Northern Euro ,so I dont know where this TV ? show researched the results.Try to access Charles Kerchner s site ,he has results from people who have had all the tests ,he s a test junkie,himself ,just GOOGLE him for MtDNA ,DNA PRINT etc., results sites. Ill try again to find the Rootsweb DNA discussion list for John Chandler. KAT.

[NormanGalway]

Tom,

I noticed on the Kerchner Tribes blog that an askenazi fellow got top match to Greek cypriot. In fact, his results look a bit like yours if I am remembering them correctly.