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Pictish Y-DNA isolated from burial sites...?

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  • ntxcousin
    replied
    Pictish roots

    Originally posted by Stevo
    I agree completely.

    Dr. Wilson has done a heck of a lot to advance the field of genetics in general and of genetic genealogy in particular.

    Like you said, the Pictish cat will be out of the tartan bag shortly anyway.
    Not fast enough for this great-grandchild of Scotland! I raise my glass of Scotch to the Picts. A people my clan claims are a part of my ancestry as much as the Norse !

    Leave a comment:


  • Stevo
    replied
    Originally posted by Rick
    For those who claim Wilson is putting business before science, two points: (1) we don't know that to be the case. The peer review process can cause the time between submission of an article for publication and the actual publication date to be 12 to 18 months or longer. We don't know if he's submitted this research for publication, and (2) so what? He is in business to make a profit after all. I for one don't begrudge his very brief monopoly on these data (which after all he invested time and money in developing). In any case as soon as the first few customers receive their results, the cat will be out of the bag on ysearch, etc.
    I agree completely.

    Dr. Wilson has done a heck of a lot to advance the field of genetics in general and of genetic genealogy in particular.

    Like you said, the Pictish cat will be out of the tartan bag shortly anyway.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rick
    replied
    For those who claim Wilson is putting business before science, two points: (1) we don't know that to be the case. The peer review process can cause the time between submission of an article for publication and the actual publication date to be 12 to 18 months or longer. We don't know if he's submitted this research for publication, and (2) so what? He is in business to make a profit after all. I for one don't begrudge his very brief monopoly on these data (which after all he invested time and money in developing). In any case as soon as the first few customers receive their results, the cat will be out of the bag on ysearch, etc.

    Leave a comment:


  • Stevo
    replied
    Originally posted by Piobaireachd
    I believe that was the Michelob haplotype...
    That would do.

    It was definitely the free beer haplotype!

    Leave a comment:


  • Piobaireachd
    replied
    Originally posted by Stevo
    They were quiet barbarians.

    Enjoyed a good beer with friends . . .

    I believe that was the Michelob haplotype...

    Leave a comment:


  • Stevo
    replied
    I am almost certain I do not have the Pictish haplotype.

    I probably have the Folks-Who-Tried-to-Mind-Their-Own-Business-and-Get-Along haplotype.

    They were quiet barbarians.

    Enjoyed a good beer with friends . . .

    Leave a comment:


  • ntxcousin
    replied
    Originally posted by K. Campbell
    I would like to pile on and concur with everyone else. Dr. James Wilson has to decide whether he is first an academic (i.e.“Dr.”) or a businessman (founder of Ethnoancestry).

    All scientists or academics understand the value of publishing their work with full and open disclosure. It’s vetting work in this manner that allows others in the scientific community to validate or repudiate the work. This is how the body of scientific knowledge grows.

    Scientists or academics value publishing their work...period! I know several PhDs, and a few scientific types, that would argue the validity of any test result if it contradicted their publish results of a similiar test. It doesn't matter which side is right or wrong in its conclusions. It all boils down to how the data is handled to prove your conclusions.

    Leave a comment:


  • K. Campbell
    replied
    Boycott Ethnoancestry!

    I would like to pile on and concur with everyone else. Dr. James Wilson has to decide whether he is first an academic (i.e.“Dr.”) or a businessman (founder of Ethnoancestry).

    All scientists or academics understand the value of publishing their work with full and open disclosure. It’s vetting work in this manner that allows others in the scientific community to validate or repudiate the work. This is how the body of scientific knowledge grows.

    Businessman Jim Wilson is attempting to make a buck off of his theory. Ethnoancestry is taking orders for their test, see
    http://www.ethnoancestry.com/Pictish...osomeTest.html
    but has refused all requests to publish the analysis on which it is based.

    The shame is that the Pict Haplotype will eventually become known. As participants results are published the Pict modal that Jim is using will eventually become clear. When this happens, Jim will lose his competitive advantage and all that will remain is the Ethnoancestry legacy of trying to make a quick buck off of their “secret sauce”. When this happens, I expect that EA will move on and discover a Celtic Modal and offer a Celtic test.

    Leave a comment:


  • ntxcousin
    replied
    putative (pre-)Pictish Y presentation

    Originally posted by Stevo
    Dr. James Wilson is a very well known and reputable scientist. He's the guy who coined the term Western Atlantic Modal Haplotype (WAMH) and discovered the S-series of SNPs. He's also president of Ethnoancestry.

    My guess is that "Pictish" set of STRs, if that's what it is, is published somewhere. It's a matter of finding it.

    The way that article presents the information does make the whole thing sound like a scam.
    http://www.rse.org.uk/events/conf200..._abstracts.pdf

    SESSION 4: The Genetic Impact – Dr James Wilson
    The Norse bequeathed a significant cultural legacy to Scotland, particularly in the Northern Isles, but also in Caithness, the Hebrides and on the west coast. The extent to which this translates into a genetic legacy, i.e. to what degree Scottish populations today descend from Viking ancestors, can now be assessed by analysis of our DNA. This has been made possible by the development of informative genetic markers which reveal significant differentiation between Celtic-speakers, Norwegian and other continental populations. Genetic types in a modern day Scottish populations can therefore be apportioned to different ancestries in order to estimate the genetic impact of the Vikings and other ‘invaders’ in each place. Analysis of
    paternally-inherited Y chromosomes in this way demonstrates a strong signature of Norse influence in Orkney and Shetland. Further evidence is provided by the analysis of surnames in Orkney, which may be divided into an indigenous category and a Scottish group. In this way samples can be filtered to enrich for those that have been resident in Orkney for longer. The indigenous group shows a higher proportion of Scandinavian ancestry than the immigrant group, whose Y chromosomes are not significantly different from those of Celtic-speakers. Extending the Y chromosome analysis to other areas of Scotland and the British Isles shows that the Northern Isles stand out in having by far the most paternal Norse ancestry, followed by the Western Isles, Durness and the Isle of Man, while the signature of more southerly invaders was seen in York and Norfolk. Maternal ancestry can be investigated using mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) which is inherited from mother to daughter. Although there is much less differentiation in European mtDNA than in Y chromosomes, signals of Norse maternal ancestry may also be elucidated in NW Scotland and the Islands. Technological advances including complete mtDNA and eventually Y chromosome DNA sequences and gene ‘chips’ which analyse hundreds of thousands of markers at once will allow
    unprecedented insights into our history. Some recent discoveries will be presented including the identification of putative (pre-)Pictish Y chromosomes, high resolution analysis of Norwegian Y chromosomes and the signature of Irish movement to Scotland.

    Leave a comment:


  • ntxcousin
    replied
    Pict test

    Originally posted by tomcat
    The Picts are believed to be the descendants of the first people to colonise Scotland after the glaciers retreated at the end of the last ice age. Until recently the degree to which present day Scots (and their diaspora) are descended from these mysterious people was unknown. However, recent genetic analysis has revealed the existence of a candidate Pictish Y chromosome signature which is found across the British Isles, most commonly in Scotland, but rarely in continental Europe. Ethnoancestry is pleased to offer a test which determines your relationship to the Pictish signature.
    The following 27 markers are included:

    DYS388 DYS439 DYS436
    DYS393 DYS389I/II DYS437
    DYS392 DYS458 DYS461
    DYS19 DYS460 DYS462
    DYS390 DYS438 DYS449
    DYS391 DYS425 YGATA- H4
    DYS385a,b DYS434 YCAIIa,b
    DYS426 DYS435 YGATA- C4
    The cost of this product is $249.
    The only markers my 67 marker test don't have are the DYS434, DYS435, DYS461, DYS462, and THE YGATA- C4. Perhaps these are the markers used for the PICT test!?

    Mike

    Leave a comment:


  • Jim Denning
    replied
    Originally posted by NormanGalway
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../14/ndna14.xml

    This sounds a bit annoying... the guy wants to make a buck instead of publicizing what the markers are??

    the guys an idiot and this is a scam. no one group like picts has all members in one haplogroup.

    file under one being born every minute

    Leave a comment:


  • tomcat
    replied
    From www.ethnoancestry.com

    The Picts are believed to be the descendants of the first people to colonise Scotland after the glaciers retreated at the end of the last ice age. Until recently the degree to which present day Scots (and their diaspora) are descended from these mysterious people was unknown. However, recent genetic analysis has revealed the existence of a candidate Pictish Y chromosome signature which is found across the British Isles, most commonly in Scotland, but rarely in continental Europe. Ethnoancestry is pleased to offer a test which determines your relationship to the Pictish signature.

    After submitting your saliva sample we will extract your DNA and test 27 markers on your Y chromosome. We will then compare your results to our company's extensive database and infer your haplogroup. This will not only allow us to recognise if you carry the Pictish type, but also allow classification into a number of other Y chromosome types, each with a distinctive history. You will receive a certificate in pdf format summarising your results.

    The following 27 markers are included:

    DYS388 DYS439 DYS436
    DYS393 DYS389I/II DYS437
    DYS392 DYS458 DYS461
    DYS19 DYS460 DYS462
    DYS390 DYS438 DYS449
    DYS391 DYS425 YGATA- H4
    DYS385a,b DYS434 YCAIIa,b
    DYS426 DYS435 YGATA- C4
    The cost of this product is $249.

    Leave a comment:


  • Stevo
    replied
    Here is another article on the same subject, but they aren't giving the haplotype away, apparently.

    Leave a comment:


  • Stevo
    replied
    Originally posted by NormanGalway
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../14/ndna14.xml

    This sounds a bit annoying... the guy wants to make a buck instead of publicizing what the markers are??
    Dr. James Wilson is a very well known and reputable scientist. He's the guy who coined the term Western Atlantic Modal Haplotype (WAMH) and discovered the S-series of SNPs. He's also president of Ethnoancestry.

    My guess is that "Pictish" set of STRs, if that's what it is, is published somewhere. It's a matter of finding it.

    The way that article presents the information does make the whole thing sound like a scam.

    Leave a comment:


  • NormanGalway
    started a topic Pictish Y-DNA isolated from burial sites...?

    Pictish Y-DNA isolated from burial sites...?

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../14/ndna14.xml

    This sounds a bit annoying... the guy wants to make a buck instead of publicizing what the markers are??
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