Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Get 160 SNPs related to P312 for only $119!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Get 160 SNPs related to P312 for only $119!

    Hello everybody,

    I need help to understand what the offer "Get 160 SNPs related to P312 for only $119!" is for.

    Will it change anything in the qualitity of the matches?
    What information does it provide, in easy words?
    Why should one make this test?

    Thank you a lot and best wishes to all!
    k

  • #2
    FTDNA's SNP packs generally have an appropriate haplo admin who can be contacted for these answers, but there are no "easy words" in genomic interpretation, and I have asked and never received an explanation from the name on the FTDNA e-mail soliciting a SNP pack for my haplogroup, and the explanation on the form provided in e-mail left me with the same questions you have.

    The R haplotype is so vast in current databases that there are subclades that might be posited from SNP packs, and the main result you might see is a new terminal SNP without having had to take Big Y.

    Some of these subclades are assigned names such as "western isles" or other geographic or even mythical (mainly Irish) nicknames, but you will see these as entries by some admins in Project subgroup names, they are not "official," and ISOGG only recognizes SNP subclades as hierarchical (number-letter-number) assignments on their tree.

    NOTE: The terminal SNP assigned by FTDNA to me has no recognition on any tree but theirs, let me warn you about that type of result. Without a history of previous FTDNA terminals and interpretations independent of FTDNA, I could not find myself using FTDNA's terminal as represented on the latest ISOGG tree for my haplo.

    I have never taken a SNP pack, having had one SNP tested at another service and then having done Big Y, but I have had reasons to recommend SNP Packs to my surname project members, as less expensive than Big Y. Also, a very reputable service that tests SNPs independently has no reciprocity with FTDNA, even though they might be doing some of their testing, so their findings would not result in a terminal SNP reassignment at FTDNA. But since no one in my group has yet taken a SNP Pack, I can only echo what I have been told by individual haplo admins.

    Hope this helps, and someone please correct me what I have been told is wrong.
    Last edited by clintonslayton76; 4 March 2018, 04:13 PM. Reason: expansion

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by keyhook View Post
      Hello everybody,

      I need help to understand what the offer "Get 160 SNPs related to P312 for only $119!" is for.

      Will it change anything in the qualitity of the matches?
      What information does it provide, in easy words?
      Why should one make this test?

      Thank you a lot and best wishes to all!
      k
      Welcome to the P312 subclade!

      I need help to understand what the offer "Get 160 SNPs related to P312 for only $119!" is for.
      To get the test results for the SNPs contained in the SNP Pack.

      Will it change anything in the qualitity of the matches?
      It will not change the quality of the matches except that if there are some matches that are positive for a subclade that is on a different branch than on your own then the common ancestor is from that point of branching. If there are matches with SNP testing that are in the same subclade then you could possibly share more subclades if both of you were to get a BigY test. There are sites that have estimated dates of when some branches were created.

      What information does it provide, in easy words?
      The information is not something very easy to understand for most people new to SNP testing.

      Why should one make this test?
      To determine what your ancient subclade is downstream from P312 if you are positive for one of the subclades. A negative result for all of the subclades is also informative in that you know you don’t belong in any of the major subclades currently documented.
      To determine if you have some 12, 37, or even 67 marker matches with SNP testing are in a different branch so you can exclude them as being from a common ancestor since the branching. Most of the time the branching is from more than 2,000 years ago for any of the branches.


      It might be best for you to join the P312 project at https://www.familytreedna.com/groups...out/background then ask the same questions in the Activity Feed. The admins that answer in there can also see your STR and your Y-DNA matches. Having that information can be helpful sometimes.

      Here is what the project site has on STRs and SNPs

      6. If you have not yet tested to 67 Y STRs (Short Tandem Repeats) please upgrade. R1b is young so it is hard to discern between subgroups and potential relatives oftentimes without 67 STRs. 111 STR testing is clearly preferable and a better deal in terms of cost per STR, but 67 is the minimum needed. To learn more, read http://www.familytreedna.com/learn/y...e-information/

      More STRs can help...

      a) guide you on SNP/haplogroup testing, saving money on that kind of testing,

      b) provide additional and better matches on your myFTDNA matches screen,

      c) improve precision for Time to Most Recent Common Ancestor (TMRCA) estimates,

      d) and going all the way to 111 Y STRs supports family tree building when you reach brick walls in your genealogy, since the 111 STR panel is estimated to have a change once every three generations.

      7. Move forward with an Single-Nucleotide Polymorphism (SNP) testing plan so your subclade can be identified and haplogroup labeled properly. Evaluating matches you have at 67 or 111 STRs can be very helpful and should not be overlooked. Clear patterns among your best matches may help you decide what SNPs or SNP Packs to buy. This project's Activity Feed as well as the R1b-P312-project yahoo group are setup to help you evaluate testing plans.

      SNPs can be ordered one at a time from FTDNA by logging into your myFTDNA account, selecting the blue UPGRADES button and then scrolling down to the ADVANCED TESTS box and the BUY NOW button. SNP Packs can also be ordered here.

      7A. Big Y is the preferred test. It is probably the most important test you can take. It is a Next Generation Sequencing (NGS) test that discovers new SNPs by scanning over 10 million locations on the Y chromosome. The tremendous benefit in this is you will discover SNPs for just your paternal lineage as well as identify ancient SNPs that you may share with many, many other people. Big Y has the ability to discover SNPs that are pertinent to the genealogical timeframe, the last couple of hundred years. The Big Y learning web site has more details. https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/...testing/big-y/ Please read the Lewis and Clark Expedition analogy for Big Y exploration on the FAQ page. https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/r-p312/faq/

      7B. The R1b-P312 SNP Pack is a very cost effective option that gives you very good coverage of R1b-P312 early branching. The SNPs for the early branching of L21, U152 and DF27 are included to direct you to another SNP Pack if needed. The subclades of DF19, DF99 and L238 have in-depth coverage of their branching. You can order a pack from your myFTDNA account. If you don't see the option, please check the blue UPGRADES button, then the BUY NOW button in the ADVANCED TESTS box, and pick SNP PACK in the SELECT A PRODUCT box. Please post on the Activity Feed forum if you need help.

      If you have a true interest in genetic genealogy and breaking beyond the brickwalls of your genealogical records, please strongly consider both Big Y to determine your haplogroup down to a very recent timeframe and 111 STRs so that you can refine your close-in family and surname mutation history tree.

      Comment


      • #4
        How altruistic are you feeling?

        Like he (Armando) said, the SNP tests do not so much supplement your surname Y test as it does help geneticists posit subclades. Bringing down a subclade might one day bring a SNP into historical times, and that is the reason for his recommendation of Big Y and 111 STR, but please realize that their goals are hard for yDNA samplers to reconcile with the expense: you will not generally see any change at your Y STR level, because FTDNA does not expand STR results from SNP tests. Only your terminal SNP might change, but maybe not.

        You might learn nothing from the test, but "deep" age-of-polymorphism interpreters need SNP testing to reach both ways: way back and sometimes (rarely) into historical times. They do not care about your surname's history. In the Y patriline surname arena, expanding to 111 Y STR actually looks for more recent mutations than the smaller tests, it does not look back, but I recommend 67-111 to all men as the only ones with meaning, that's just me.

        So you are adding to a pool of knowledge that may have no meaning at all to you. I did Big Y while it was on sale, after being denied service by another Y genome interpreter, and the cost was reasonable for me at about 3x what a SNP pack would have been, but either way, I wanted to contribute beyond 111 STR to the knowledge of my haplo advisers. As a result, I appear to have been given a meaningless terminal SNP as of today, by FTDNA. But I have used project admins and other interpreters through RAW and VCF files, and learned far more from them than from the FTDNA service itself.

        As I stated in my first answer, develop a line of communication with your haplo admin(s) at the P312 project. Only you can decide if you are getting anything for your money, I do not deal with that project's two admins or co-admins, but will if my surname project R haplo men fit into that P312 branch and wish to contribute.

        Incidentally, another service that interprets but does not test SNPS can derive ~400 STR values from a Big Y, but it is interesting that while the STR calculations from SNPs are considered more accurate than STR tests at 111, no additional STR values accrue from Big Y to any Y test you might have taken at FTDNA. Funny old world, in't it?

        At one point, FTDNA offered FREE expansion of any existing Y test to 111 if Big Y was purchased, which in my opinion should be the default deal.
        Last edited by clintonslayton76; 4 March 2018, 05:57 PM. Reason: spacing

        Comment

        Working...
        X