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  • Originally posted by Eki
    I found an interesting antropological map in Kalevi Wiik's book "Suomalaisten juuret" (Roots of Finns). He had calculated what he calls "north-western percentage" for 74 different area in Europe based on how blond, tall, big headed and narrow faced people are (I guess a tall narrow faced blonde with big head would be 100%). I'll try to post the map scanned as an attachment. I don't know if it works, since I've never tried it before here.

    Anyway, the percentage for western Finland 84% differs much from the percentage for central Finland 69%. The closest match nearby for western Finland can be found in central Norway around the Trondheim area. I think that further supports my theory that people have moved from central Norway to western Finland in pre-historic times. Scotland and southern Denmark also have 84%, but they are further away.
    Is that a cephalic index?

    Can you provide a link to an explanation?

    A cephalic index is the ratio of the maximum width of the head to its maximum length, multiplied by 100. The measurement is taken at the top of the skull using calipers, I believe.

    The higher numbers indicate a rounder head, i.e, when the width and length are nearly equal. Thus an index of 100 would indicate a round head.

    Lower numbers indicate a longer, narrower skull.

    Scores under 75 are considered dolichocephalic or "long headed."

    Scores from 75-80 are mesocephalic or "medium headed."

    A score of greater than 80 is considered brachycephalic or "short headed" (round headed).

    Dolichocephaly is considered a "Nordic" trait, although it is also present in Mediterranean populations.

    Fascinating map.

    Your "tall, narrow-faced blond" would tend to the lower end of the cephalic index (under 75). A round-headed person (many orientals tend to round-headedness) would approach the higher end of the scale.

    Looking at that map, however, it seems like the inverse of what one would expect of the typical cephalic index. An explanation would really help in understanding it.

    Here is a brief explanation of the cephalic index.
    Last edited by Stevo; 7 June 2006, 07:29 AM.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Stevo
      Scores under 75 are considered dolichocephalic or "long headed."

      Scores from 75-80 are mesocephalic or "medium headed."

      A score of greater than 80 is considered brachycephalic or "short headed" (round headed).

      Dolichocephaly is considered a "Nordic" trait, although it is also present in Mediterranean populations.
      Then the map would indicate Mediterranean populations are dolichocephalic

      Comment


      • Originally posted by F.E.C.
        Then the map would indicate Mediterranean populations are dolichocephalic
        In the old racial classifications of people in Europe as "Nordic," "Alpine-Dinaric," and "Mediterranean," dolichocephaly was considered a characteristic of Nordic and Mediterranean populations.

        Brachycephaly was considered Alpine-Dinaric.

        Mesocephaly, it was thought, resulted from Alpine-Dinaric admixture in Nordic or Mediterranean populations.

        I'm not sure how accurate an indicator of geographic origin the cephalic index really is.

        The low scores to the East on that map are surprising and give me pause, as do some of the high scores elsewhere.

        I could be wrong, but it looks to me like that map has the index backwards (inverted). Roundheadedness should increase to the east and as one goes toward the center of Europe.
        Last edited by Stevo; 7 June 2006, 07:41 AM.

        Comment


        • The more I think about it, the more I wonder if that map is about the traditional cephalic index at all. Some of those scores are radically low.

          Does anyone really have a head that narrow?

          Maybe Eki can clear things up by posting a link to an explanation.

          Comment


          • Here is an old map of the cephalic index in Europe.

            Comment


            • Cephalic index is just one factor in this "north western percentage" map. The map and its percentages are based on maps Coon draw in 1939. One of Coon's maps was "Pigmentation of Hair and Eyes", one was "Stature", one was "Head Size" and one was "Cephalic Index". Wiik combined those maps in 1995 so that all aforementioned qualities are combined into one single percentage number, since he observed that those qualities correlated with each other.
              I can scan those Coon maps for you later.

              The explanation is in a book and in Finnish, but it translates to "North western percentages of 74 areas. The higher the figure, the blonder, taller, bigger headed and narrower faced people in those areas are".

              Originally posted by Stevo
              Is that a cephalic index?

              Can you provide a link to an explanation?

              A cephalic index is the ratio of the maximum width of the head to its maximum length, multiplied by 100. The measurement is taken at the top of the skull using calipers, I believe.

              The higher numbers indicate a rounder head, i.e, when the width and length are nearly equal. Thus an index of 100 would indicate a round head.

              Lower numbers indicate a longer, narrower skull.

              Scores under 75 are considered dolichocephalic or "long headed."

              Scores from 75-80 are mesocephalic or "medium headed."

              A score of greater than 80 is considered brachycephalic or "short headed" (round headed).

              Dolichocephaly is considered a "Nordic" trait, although it is also present in Mediterranean populations.

              Fascinating map.

              Your "tall, narrow-faced blond" would tend to the lower end of the cephalic index (under 75). A round-headed person (many orientals tend to round-headedness) would approach the higher end of the scale.

              Looking at that map, however, it seems like the inverse of what one would expect of the typical cephalic index. An explanation would really help in understanding it.

              Here is a brief explanation of the cephalic index.

              Comment


              • Ah. So the index used for the map you posted is kind of an index of "Nordic-ness," for lack of a better term.

                Interesting.

                If you could post more info on how he developed that index, I would appreciate it.

                It's interesting.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Stevo
                  Ah. So the index used for the map you posted is kind of an index of "Nordic-ness," for lack of a better term.

                  Interesting.

                  If you could post more info on how he developed that index, I would appreciate it.

                  It's interesting.
                  He doesn't tell the details of the procedure, but he then uses the percentages to divide Europe into 4 zones based on their "north-westerness". The zones are marked in the attached map. 1 means the most "north-western" and 4 the least.
                  Attached Files

                  Comment


                  • I didn't know Greece was more "northwestern" (if I understood correctly what northwesterness is ) than Italy...

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by F.E.C.
                      I didn't know Greece was more "northwestern" (if I understood correctly what northwesterness is ) than Italy...
                      I wouldn't think the Spanish were any more "northwestern" than Italians either. But it appears northern Italy is as "northwestern" as Spain and Greece.

                      Interesting.

                      It seems those maps are based on the characteristics that used to be used to define what was once called the Nordic subfamily (or sub-race) of the European geographical race.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Stevo
                        It seems those maps are based on the characteristics that used to be used to define what was once called the Nordic subfamily (or sub-race) of the European geographical race.
                        Unfortunately those old theories have a dark history and were abused in a terrible way. Even now, Wiik seems to be worried that some people might take his research as "racist" and points out that it's not the case. The past atrocities must not be forgotten, but I hope the world will be ready to look at and discuss the differences between people neutrally without attributing labels like "superior" or "inferior" to them.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Eki
                          Unfortunately those old theories have a dark history and were abused in a terrible way. Even now, Wiik seems to be worried that some people might take his research as "racist" and points out that it's not the case. The past atrocities must not be forgotten, but I hope the world will be ready to look at and discuss the differences between people neutrally without attributing labels like "superior" or "inferior" to them.
                          I agree. I didn't mean to imply that Wiik was being racist. Observations about physical similarities or physical types are interesting and informative.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Stevo
                            Does anyone really have a head that narrow?
                            How narrow?

                            My cephalic index is 74

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Stevo
                              I wouldn't think the Spanish were any more "northwestern" than Italians either. But it appears northern Italy is as "northwestern" as Spain and Greece.

                              Interesting.

                              It seems those maps are based on the characteristics that used to be used to define what was once called the Nordic subfamily (or sub-race) of the European geographical race.
                              Stevo,
                              the point is I don't think the map is very accurate.

                              I've been in many places all around Europe and I can tell you for sure you can't distinguish a southern Italian from an average Spaniard, Portuguese or Greek whereas it's generally easy to note the differences with the Turks.

                              On the other hand it would be difficult to find physical differences in terms of hair and complexion between the average northern Italian and a French.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by lazerus
                                How narrow?

                                My cephalic index is 74
                                I was talking about scores like 25 and 22 on that map. When I saw them I started to suspect that the map is not a cephalic index, and it isn't.

                                I'm longheaded myself, although I've never bothered to measure it.

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