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  • A Few Questions for Better Understanding

    I have been doing genealogy for about 10 years now mostly on my father's side as someone on my mothers side has also been doing extensive work. I have accumulated over 10k documents like military, marriage, etc. during that time through extensive research at both state and national archives. For Christmas my wife ordered me a YDNA 37 test and I have submitted it and should receive the results it said by the end of February but I really have no idea what to expect, how to use it in my genealogy work, or the value of it. So I have a few questions.

    1) Since it is the 37 test will it be sufficient enough to get me at least started tracking DNA and how useful will I find it as a beginner?

    2) I know there is a 67 and 111 as well, so should I go ahead and add one of those as well and if so now before I get my results back or wait until I get the 37 back first?

    3) If I do add one is the 67 sufficient then go onto a BigY test and subgroup test or should I consider going with the 111?

    4) Once the results come back will there be a basic breakdown on how to interpret the results?

    Again new at this and was since I received it as a present might as well get the most from it and any help is appreciated.

  • #2
    I don't have an answer to all of your questions. We chose the Y37 for my husband because I read that it would be sufficient, but I feel like we peeked into the rabbit hole and we should have just jumped in.

    We did find people who matched his Y-DNA, though not many, but it was interesting that a couple were in Germany (which is where his first ancestor bearing the surname came from in the early 1700s).

    None of the others who match his YDNA who have tested have traced further back than 1600, which will maybe add 4 more generations to his tree if they have information leading to his immigrant ancestor.

    Now, from what I've read, the haplogroup he got was a prediction, so it's not set in stone, and it can break down further into a haplotype. We initially wanted the Y111 but settled for this, but I think we'll soon be upgrading. I need to talk to more informed people myself to see where to go from here.

    The dashboard is updated when your results come in. I'm attaching the before and after so you can see what to expect. I think it's pretty straightforward.
    Attached Files

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    • #3
      Y-DNA testing only follows your father's father's father's etc. line. A 37 marker test will probably be enough to tell you whether or not there was any misattributed parentage in the last few hundred years, provided you get enough matches.

      But if you want to verify your father's other lines (and your mother's as well) you need Family Finder. If your parents are living, you should test both of them. If any of your grandparents are living, you should get Family Finder tests for as many of them as possible.

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      • #4
        Don't forget aunts and uncles or grand aunts and uncles--the first commandment of genetic genealogy is to test your oldest generation first.

        The nice thing about FTDNA is they will store the sample for 25 years, so if you later want to test their mtDNA or YDNA you will have the sample to do so. Test with Family Finder (atDNA) on as many as you can afford.

        Family Finder shows more recent genealogy, up to 4 or 5 generations back, and may help you to build the tree that you need to find any males who match on that YDNA surname line of your tree.

        If you test your parents and their siblings, you reach back an extra generation and grandparents and their siblings get you back two extra generations.

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        • #5
          Some useful resources:

          https://sites.google.com/site/wheato...etic-genealogy

          https://www.amazon.com/Family-Guide-.../dp/1440345325

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by TNFann View Post
            I have been doing genealogy for about 10 years now mostly on my father's side as someone on my mothers side has also been doing extensive work. I have accumulated over 10k documents like military, marriage, etc. during that time through extensive research at both state and national archives. For Christmas my wife ordered me a YDNA 37 test and I have submitted it and should receive the results it said by the end of February but I really have no idea what to expect, how to use it in my genealogy work, or the value of it. So I have a few questions.

            1) Since it is the 37 test will it be sufficient enough to get me at least started tracking DNA and how useful will I find it as a beginner?

            2) I know there is a 67 and 111 as well, so should I go ahead and add one of those as well and if so now before I get my results back or wait until I get the 37 back first?

            3) If I do add one is the 67 sufficient then go onto a BigY test and subgroup test or should I consider going with the 111?

            4) Once the results come back will there be a basic breakdown on how to interpret the results?

            Again new at this and was since I received it as a present might as well get the most from it and any help is appreciated.
            1)Only if another person that has similar STR markers to you will you see a match. They can have as many as a 4 marker difference and still show as a match. However, just because they show as a match doesn't mean for a fact that the common direct paternal ancestor is from a genealogical time frame. The common direct paternal ancestor could be from thousands of years ago. If they have a Y67 or Y111 in the match list then you can get an upgrade to see if the match still holds at 67 markers or, in rare cases, if new matches show up that didn't at 37 markers. However, you can still have the problem of the matches being due to a common direct paternal ancestor could be from thousands of years ago. Then you would want to have your match or matches upgrade to Y111 or to BigY and for you to do the same in order to prove that the common direct paternal ancestor is from within a genealogical time period.


            2)Basically, it's best not to upgrade unless you have matches that are willing to upgrade and don't make assumptions until both you and the matches have proved a common direct paternal ancestor with advanced testing. If your 37 marker matches have well documented trees and advanced testing already then everything will be very simple for you. If not, then you might want to be very patient. The best news is that the DNA testing is a lot faster these past 3 months than the previous couple of years so at least that part won't be frustrating. If you want to upgrade right now just so you have the results very soon and that way whenever you do finally have a Y67 or Y111 match it isn't a bad idea either but know ahead of time that the match might not exist for a very long time in the future.

            3)It's better to wait for a match at 67 markers then decide if Y111 or BigY is better considering the situation.

            4)There is information such as what has already been posted but I haven't seen much that really compares STR marker matches at different GDs (Genetic Distances) having the TMRCA being proven with BigY testing except for a statement by Dr. Doug McDonald, but I can't find the exact statement, and the videos by John Cleary at https://youtu.be/O81G3No1SOY and https://youtu.be/pxexkvfus6w I think that those videos will help you immensely since they have an example of people with different surnames matching at 67 STR markers and how they used BigY testing to group them based on SNPs and provided an estimated date to the common SNPs.

            The best way to learn is from getting tested and if you are lucky enough to have close matches it will be a whole lot easier.
            Last edited by Armando; 25 January 2017, 03:34 PM.

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            • #7
              I just looked at what the FTDNA learning center has to say about STR matches at https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/...ionship-match/

              Based on what I have seen with matches with well documented trees and with what was shown in the John Cleary videos I think they should change the Probably Related to Possibly Related and state "You may have a connection in more distant genealogical times (less than 15 generations) but could also be even more distant than 15 generations" That's for a GD of 5-6 at 37 markers and a GD of 6-7 at 111 markers. It should also have a link to an explanation of the need to prove the match holds up with more STRs if the person has only tested to 37 markers or 67 markers and that the BigY will at times provide the tester and the match with enough novel SNPs to prove that the common direct paternal ancestor is within the past 500 years if both the tester and the match get the BigY.

              The TiP calculator is just an estimate

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              • #8
                It is also beneficial for you to join your Surname and haplogroup projects at FTDNA, as their admins will be able to give you advice on what additional testing (additional STR and/or SNP testing) may suit your needs, based on how you are grouped in projects.

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                • #9
                  Thanks for all the responses and yes my kit also included the family finder kit as well. I also joined many of the surname projects via the site as well.

                  In regards to family both parents and both grand parents are all gone. I do have an aunt still around and other great aunt and uncles as well. If I can figure how useful the results are and how to use everything I may try testing some of them at the family reunion in the summer.

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                  • #10
                    I would not wait to test your aunt and great aunts/uncles. Autosomal DNA, tested in Family Finder, has a different inheritance than YDNA. The YDNA reaches back much further because doesn't change much between generations, an occasional mutation, but often handed down unchanged. If you don't test the older generation, you still have the chance to match your relatives in subsequent generations, no sweat.

                    For atDNA, with each generation you are losing DNA and the matches they would make. My oldest generation was my parents and I came close to missing some of those that were remaining. I can see the difference working with several siblings makes in that generation compared to siblings in my generation.

                    All the children inherit about half their DNA from each parent, which means they also miss out on 50% of each parent's DNA. Because of the way atDNA is passed down, the children will some DNA that overlaps but may also inherit different DNA than their siblings. Some of the DNA may only be inherited by one child, some will not make it to the next generation.

                    My advice, call your great uncles and aunts and get them tested now--then at the reunion you can show them the results! You will be the hit of the reunion, everyone's favorite cousin
                    Last edited by GenealogyKeeper; 25 January 2017, 09:28 PM.

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