If YOU ARE ONE, BE ONE

[F.E.C.]

Ehi Mike look at the guy just below me on the Italy Project, doesn't that look like an Irish haplotype? He's got an Italian name though.

BTW, to you all (except to Stevo, whom I suggest to name honorary citizen )
stop joining to the Italy project if you are not Italian PLEASE !!!!

[Stevo]

Ehi Mike look at the guy just below me on the Italy Project, doesn't that look like an Irish haplotype? He's got an Italian name though.

BTW, to you all (except to Stevo, whom I suggest to name honorary citizen )
stop joining to the Italy project if you are not Italian PLEASE !!!!

Thanks, Francesco!

I accept status as an honorary Italian with deep, heart-felt gratitude.

I am not worthy!

Our ancestors had to serve in the legions for 25 years to be made Roman citizens!

[Stevo]

What is Frisian?

I thought that it was the story of a father and his two sons who said Hay to some Danes (and so on and so forth). Oh well, I guess that is Frisian.

Frisian is also the language closest to English. Both are in the West Germanic group.

I think the R1b-Frisian group includes most of the R1b in Denmark, and R1b is the biggest y-haplogroup there.

[Stevo]

I've been busy at work the last couple of days and haven't had much free time during the day to post on here.

I'd have to say that my semi-educated guess is that you're Frisian of some sort. As I mentioned in an earlier posting, EthnoAncestry has found a strong correlation between R1b's that match the Frisian modal haplotypes and testing S21+.

If you do want to SNP test, it would be better to test at EthnoAncestry, even though you would be paying more. This is because you would have to submit a new sample to another company. At this point, FTDNA does not test for S21 or the other R1b SNPs discovered last year by EthnoAncestry.

Mike

I can probably convince the old lady that another $79 for an FTDNA deep clade test is worthwhile, but I will probably wind up sleeping out on the balcony if I try to talk her into another $200 or more for Ethnoancestry's test!

I am still waiting for markers 26-37. How will they affect my modal haplotype? I wonder.

Frisian makes a lot of sense in my case, though. My paternal paper trail ends with my ggg-grandfather and his two brothers, but I know their mother was a Dutch-American. Maybe her husband, my gggg-grandfather, was also a Dutch-American, since the odds are that I am R1b-Frisian, and my surname, Stevens, is fairly common in the Netherlands.

Thanks for your help though, Mike. You make this stuff a whole lot easier.

[MMaddi]

Ehi Mike look at the guy just below me on the Italy Project, doesn't that look like an Irish haplotype? He's got an Italian name though.

Francesco,

The one below you in the table is in the E3b haplogroup. I'm looking at the two results right above you on the table, kits N21805 and 57619, which are R1b. But neither have a surname and neither look particularly close to the key markers in the Irish haplotypes. Which result are you talking about?

I did note when looking at your haplotype that your 390=24, which is the modal value in all the various modals listed on Ken Nordtvedt's table, EXCEPT for the Frisian modals. The value for all Frisian modal haplotypes at 390=23. That is my value there and Steve's too. Remember that 390 is regarded as a slow mutating marker, so that seems to be significant.

This is interesting since both you and I are S21+, yet I match the Frisian and you don't. That would imply that your deep ancestry is different than mine, but we share very deep ancestry by both being S21+.

Mike

[F.E.C.]

Francesco,

The one below you in the table is in the E3b haplogroup. I'm looking at the two results right above you on the table, kits N21805 and 57619, which are R1b. But neither have a surname and neither look particularly close to the key markers in the Irish haplotypes. Which result are you talking about?

Mike I forgot to mention that I sorted the names by haplogroup, thus the one below me is the R1b1 guy with 25 at DYS390.

[F.E.C.]

I did note when looking at your haplotype that your 390=24, which is the modal value in all the various modals listed on Ken Nordtvedt's table, EXCEPT for the Frisian modals. The value for all Frisian modal haplotypes at 390=23. That is my value there and Steve's too. Remember that 390 is regarded as a slow mutating marker, so that seems to be significant.

This is interesting since both you and I are S21+, yet I match the Frisian and you don't. That would imply that your deep ancestry is different than mine, but we share very deep ancestry by both being S21+.

Mike

Yes Mike, I don't belong to the Frisian cluster.
My haplotype is uncommon indeed and that's why I think it could be part of a cluster related to a European population that has not been adequately sampled yet. Pperhaps deep native Italian R1b. Who knows? At now I can only wait and spend my time with stupid conjectures. I am 23 do you think I can know something more before I die?

[F.E.C.]

Thanks, Francesco!

I accept status as an honorary Italian with deep, heart-felt gratitude.

I am not worthy!

Our ancestors had to serve in the legions for 25 years to be made Roman citizens!

If S21 originated in Italy you could be more Italian then looooooots of Italians

[Stevo]

If S21 originated in Italy you could be more Italian then looooooots of Italians

That's right!

Cool!

Maybe that explains why Italian food is my favorite.

[F.E.C.]

Yes Mike, I don't belong to the Frisian cluster.
My haplotype is uncommon indeed and that's why I think it could be part of a cluster related to a European population that has not been adequately sampled yet. Pperhaps deep native Italian R1b. Who knows?

I was checking though and I noticed that I have a difference of minimum 5 out of 12 values with the nearest unequivocally Italian R1b match...that's an enormous mismatch!
On the Italy Project I only have a 10/12 match with a Brazilian (!) R1b1

[Stevo]

At 389-2 (389ii) I have 29 repeats (common for R1b).

What is that in some other systems? On Sorenson's database the highest value for 389-2 is 20. Is that score combined with something else now?

Is there a web site that describes the R1b modal haplotypes and their meaning in greater detail?

[MMaddi]

Mike I forgot to mention that I sorted the names by haplogroup, thus the one below me is the R1b1 guy with 25 at DYS390.

Other than the 25 at 390, to me he doesn't look like a very good fit for any of the Irish modals.

Mike

[MMaddi]

At 389-2 (389ii) I have 29 repeats (common for R1b).

What is that in some other systems? On Sorenson's database the highest value for 389-2 is 20. Is that score combined with something else now?

I believe for Sorenson's database to get a figure as FTDNA would put it for 389ii, you have to take the 389i and add it to Sorenson's figure for 389ii. So, if Sorenson has a 389i for someone of 13 and a 389ii of 16, the corresponding 389ii in FTDNA terminology would be 29.

Is there a web site that describes the R1b modal haplotypes and their meaning in greater detail?

I'm not sure this will give you exactly the answer you're looking for, but try this page on John McEwan's website - http://www.geocities.com/mcewanjc/s21.htm or some of the other pages there.

Mike

[Stevo]

I believe for Sorenson's database to get a figure as FTDNA would put it for 389ii, you have to take the 389i and add it to Sorenson's figure for 389ii. So, if Sorenson has a 389i for someone of 13 and a 389ii of 16, the corresponding 389ii in FTDNA terminology would be 29.



I'm not sure this will give you exactly the answer you're looking for, but try this page on John McEwan's website - http://www.geocities.com/mcewanjc/s21.htm or some of the other pages there.

Mike

Thanks once again, Mike!

I'll check that out.

[Stevo]

Is there an R1b project?

I guess maybe there couldn't be: too many guys are R1b.

But anyway, is there?