If YOU ARE ONE, BE ONE

[Stevo]

You should do the upgrade Stevo just to find out the most you can about your DNA haplotype. You know you'll eventually do it, so just get it over with & have it done now! Do it, do it, do it...

That is a strong argument mainly because it has the force of truth behind it.

Are you in sales?

[Stevo]

How often do you get to be on the cutting edge of science? You can buy books anytime! You can even borrow them from your local library

Elise

You haven't seen my local library!

Its history section leaves much to be desired.

But, yeah, I'll probably do the upgrade.

I really want this book I saw at Borders on the Indo-Europeans and a really shiny, photo-filled new one on the Celts.

I guess the books can wait.

I've got a graduate class on Stalinism coming up in the fall. I'll be doing a lot of reading then.

[efgen]

You haven't seen my local library!
Its history section leaves much to be desired.

There's always the Library of Congress...

[Stevo]

There's always the Library of Congress...

Yes, a bit of Paradise right on earth!

[lgmayka]

Somebody talk me into upgrading to 67 markers.

As an R1b, you have far more reason to upgrade to 67 markers than someone of any other haplogroup.

Look at me. I paid for 67-marker upgrades for myself and my uncle, and full 67-marker tests (and mtDNAplus tests!) for my cousin and my parish priest, only to find out--after shelling out all that money--that unless you are in R1b, I1a, or J2, no one cares about the other 30 markers anyway.

Oh well. I haven't actually seen the recent Invisible Man movie, but according to one reviewer, when the man has to remove all his clothing for the experiment, he says, "Hey, it's for science."

[Stevo]

As an R1b, you have far more reason to upgrade to 67 markers than someone of any other haplogroup.

Look at me. I paid for 67-marker upgrades for myself and my uncle, and full 67-marker tests (and mtDNAplus tests!) for my cousin and my parish priest, only to find out--after shelling out all that money--that unless you are in R1b, I1a, or J2, no one cares about the other 30 markers anyway.

Oh well. I haven't actually seen the recent Invisible Man movie, but according to one reviewer, when the man has to remove all his clothing for the experiment, he says, "Hey, it's for science."

A compelling as well as poignant argument.

I do wish for your sake we could get more East and Southeast Europeans tested. I wish we could just get more continental Europeans of any kind tested. We need something to balance out all the British Isles stuff.

You're right, of course, in what you wrote above. I probably will order the upgrade to 67 markers.

[Stevo]

All right, you all talked me into it.



I just ordered the upgrade to 67 markers.

I'm just too addicted to genetic genealogy right now.

All my life I've had this desire to know who I am in terms of history and family. I'm hoping the more information I can provide to the R1b researchers, the more they will eventually be able to tell us.

I ordered the upgrade knowing full well that until Sponge Bob agrees to test, I have little chance of a match.

[F.E.C.]

So you think the upgrade is a good choice for a R1b?

My guess was the 67 marker upgrade is meaningful only for genealogical

purposes, for example to confirm a 34/37 match. I confess I'm mostly

interested in learning about my deep (ancient) ancestry and I don't care so

much about genealogy. To know who was my grandfather's granfather is

enough to me, at least FOR NOW.

What's the use for the upgrade when I barely have a 12 marker match?

[CharlesC]

DNA testing is still in it's early stages. The more folks that participate, the more accurate we can delineate relationships. Today, you may have only 1 or 2 12/12 matches. 5 or 10 years from now - you could literally have thousands. By updating regularly, you give later-arrivals a good chance for connection to you - 12/12 is nice, but not nearly definitive, IMHO.

I don't want to be morose, but life is unpredictable. Today you have a choice - tomorrow, you don't know. (And no, I don't get paid for this unsolicited encouragement. )

Charles Coons

[efgen]

What's the use for the upgrade when I barely have a 12 marker match?

That was my thought, until someone recently pointed out that it *is* possible have a 10/12 match and then end up with 23/25 or 35/37 after upgrading. In other words, having mismatches in the first 12 markers doesn't guarantee you will have additional mismatches at 25 or 37 markers.

There's an example of this in a project that I'm in. Most of the members matched 12/12, but one guy matched the rest (including his own cousin) 10/12 or 11/12. Once they all upgraded, he matched everyone at virtually every other marker. So this guy just happened to have an uncommon mutation at one of the less common markers to mutate and if he hadn't upgraded to more markers, he would have never known that he had close matches after all.

So my opinion -- upgrade to at least 25, preferrably 37, and see what happens. 12 markers just doesn't give you enough information in this case.

[Stevo]

I bought the upgrade to 67 markers because of the work being done by John McEwan, Charles Kerchner, Ken Nordtvedt and others in correlating STRs and SNPs and geographical origins.

Right now I do not actually know from where in Europe my immigrant y-dna ancestor came. Germany maybe, but it could be England or the Netherlands or somewhere else. It seems most of my nearest near-hits are in the British Isles (especially England) and Germany.

In a few years, with the steady accumulation of STR and SNP data, researchers might be able to narrow things down a bit. Maybe our dna will tell us from what region our ancestors came.

That's what I want to know.

[Stevo]

I bought the upgrade to 67 markers because of the work being done by John McEwan, Charles Kerchner, Ken Nordtvedt and others in correlating STRs and SNPs and geographical origins.

Right now I do not actually know from where in Europe my immigrant y-dna ancestor came. Germany maybe, but it could be England or the Netherlands or somewhere else. It seems most of my nearest near-hits are in the British Isles (especially England) and Germany.

In a few years, with the steady accumulation of STR and SNP data, researchers might be able to narrow things down a bit. Maybe our dna will tell us from what region our ancestors came.

That's what I want to know.

By the way, one of the things that persuaded me was something Mike Maddi posted awhile back along the same lines of what I wrote above. His words at that time have been on my mind since he wrote them. They were a big part of the reason I decided to go with the upgrade.

Here is what he wrote back on June 20th:

Hell, I don't even have a 12/12 marker match in any database, which is just about unheard of for an R1b. I started out with 37 markers because I know that eventually I'll need that many markers to compare with others, since my goal is to find someone I match very closely so that I can find out the surname of my great-grandfather's father. My great-grandfather was abandoned at birth and is my brick wall.

I did upgrade from 37 to 67 markers, even though it won't help me in that goal any more than 37 markers will. My thinking is that I would like to contribute to advancing knowledge about R1b haplotypes and what that might mean as to predicting deep ancestry. For instance, I think it will be very interesting, once the marker upgrades are all in, to see what are the differences on markers 38-67 among various forms of R1b, especially S21. I would like to know how I match up with other S21+'s on markers 38-67. And, who knows, maybe something I learn from my values for 38-67 will aid me in the future in knocking down my brick wall.

Mike

Of course, Elise, Igmayka, and ragnar also helped persuade me.

I think I wanted to be persuaded, though.

[efgen]

Of course, Elise, Igmayka, and ragnar also helped persuade me. I think I wanted to be persuaded, though.

You were *begging* to be persuaded!

Elise

[Stevo]

You were *begging* to be persuaded!

Elise

Pravda!

[davis1946]

DNA forum/genforum

I'll post this here because I don't want to post on Jenifer Johnson's thread. But, she is posting at the DNA forum on genealogy.com. And, trashing this forum. This post is a threat if you ask me.


On January 5, 2006, President Bush signed into law: H.R. 3402, the "Violence Against Women and Department of Justice Reauthorization Act of 2005," which reauthorizes the Violence Against Women Act for for years 2007-2011, makes amendments to criminal and immigration law, consolidates major law enforcement grant programs and authorizes appropriations for the Department of Justice for for years 2006-2009. According to "TITLE I--ENHANCING JUDICIAL AND LAW ENFORCEMENT TOOLS TO COMBAT VIOLENCE AGAINST WOMEN, Section 113. Preventing Cyberstalking ... Whoever ... utilizes any device or software that can be used to originate telecommunications or other types of communications that are transmitted, in whole or in part, by the Internet ... without disclosing his identity and with intent to annoy, abuse, threaten, or harass any person ... who receives the communications ... shall be fined under title 18 or imprisoned not more than two years, or both."


You have been warned.