Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Deep Haplogroup Test for I

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Deep Haplogroup Test for I

    Has anyone received results for the new deep haplogroup SNP test for haplogroup I? There are some SNPs in there for which there are no known STR data (i.e. M21 and M72). Regardless of whether you are positive for these two SNPs, I am interested in hearing from you as we try to construct and accurate and up-to-date tree for haplogroup I. Thanks,

    Phil Goff

  • #2
    Hi Phil,

    I was actually thinking about the getting the SNP test myself (I'm predicted as an "I" and the haplogroup predictor says I'm a strong I1a. My only hold-up is that I'm told I'm likely "I1a-AS" (Anglo-Saxon), or "I1a-N" (Norse)...I was thinking the SNP test would pin down which, but apparently its DYS462 that holds the key, and as I understand it, the SNP test wont be any help there.

    I have tested with SMGF as well, so once those results are posted in their searchable database, I should be able to pin that down through a process of elimination.

    I don't know if/how much it helps you, but I'd be happy to share the results I have now and/or what I get after the SMGF results.

    Scott

    Comment


    • #3
      New Y-Hap I SNP Test

      Originally posted by pgo1963
      Has anyone received results for the new deep haplogroup SNP test for haplogroup I? There are some SNPs in there for which there are no known STR data (i.e. M21 and M72). Regardless of whether you are positive for these two SNPs, I am interested in hearing from you as we try to construct and accurate and up-to-date tree for haplogroup I. Thanks,

      Phil Goff
      I assume you saw my post on the "New Y-Hap I sub-clade structure" thread. I am still waiting for my deep SNP test for Hg I. You mention M21 and M72 for I1a2 and I1a3. What is your reaction to FTDNA dropping the P40 SNP test for I1a1? FTDNA's response to my question seems to stop short of a commitment to a separate test for P40 if both M21 and M72 are negative. I will be happy to share my SNP and STR data.
      Floyd Oakes

      Comment


      • #4
        So Much to Discuss

        Greetings everyone,

        I recently took a "deep" (subclade level) SNP test from DNAHeritage. I typed as I1b2.**

        **(This was before the proposed changes in HG I nomenclature. The proposed changed term for my subclade is I1b1a, I believe. Confusingly, they also proposed changing the former I1* to I1b2, and the former I1c to I1b2a. I want to be clear that I am positive at M170, P37 and M26).

        My direct male ancestor is from the mountains of north Calabria in Italy. From what I have read online, 0.6 % of Calabrians type as I do, and around 1% of Italians. Over 40% of Sardinians and 30% of Castilians type the same.

        I'd be happy to answer any questions about my ancestry or the test. I just ordered a 43 marker STR test, so will hopefully have some more data very shortly.

        In the meantime, I'd like any Hg I aficionados to help me in going through some models and exercises and theories.

        Here goes:

        My subclade is so unique that it presents a fascinating story. It is not found east of the Appennines in Italy. It is present in the following countries only and in this order of frequency: Sardinia (Italy); Spain (Castile and Basque Country); France; Ireland; Italy (mainland); Sweden and Portugal. It does not exist anywhere else.

        I jokingly call I1b2 "Tyrrenian Modal Haplotype" because almost every country where it is present touches the Tyrhenian / Western Mediterranean.

        The theory, correct me if I am wrong, is that Hg I originated (mutated to more or less current form) in the Balkans, near modern Croatia.

        The I1b2 part is also clear. The paper I read indicates that some Hg I carriers headed west before the Last Glacial maximum and were stranded alongside the R1b carriers in the (theoretical) Iberian refuge area.

        Many people accept the "ethnic" terms of the pre-LGM R1b carriers as "Aurignacians" and the pre-LGM I carriers as "Gravettians."

        Who were these (Gravettian) I1b2 carriers who headed west? Were they conquerors of the Aurignacs? Or slaves? Were they early merchants? Or just men who married into the Aurignacian area?

        Either way, it appears the I1b2 carriers clearly waited out the LGM in Iberia/Cantabria/S. France, and then populated Sardinia, where genetic drift or bottlenecking made them a significant plurality.

        What is fascinating, is that I1b2 appears to be the sidecar of the R1b motorcycle. In every country where R1b is the heavy majority, I1b2 seems to represent a tiny fraction of that populace: I1b2 is more or less correlated to an R1b supermajority.

        Another mystery: how did I1b2 get to mainland Italy? The Sardinians domesticated the grape, and the earliest tribes in my ancestors' region were the Oenotri ("grape growers") and the Itali ("inhabitants of the land of the life giving calf"). Makes you wonder whether the Oenotri were Sardinian colonists.

        (As a side note/mystery, most historians agree that Sardinians traveled to modern-day Lebanon and Egypt and Israel. Yet there is no I1b2 in either of the three.)

        Even more of a mystery is how it reached Sweden. The authors of the paper I read seem to think some of the earliest settlers of Scandinavia bore I1b2.

        I'd love to hear your thoughts and pet theories. If you would like the links to any of my information, I'd be happy to provide them.

        Thanks in advance.
        Last edited by YCCHgI; 7 February 2006, 08:05 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          I recently received SNP results and was placed into the subgroup I*. This information does not help me at all as it seems there is little information on my subgroup. Fiqures, I always was the oddball in the group.. . I'm hoping to garner more information about I* but I suppose I'll have to wait for more data to be tested...

          Comment


          • #6
            Camoe,

            Do you have solid information where your oldest known paternal ancestor originated? My understanding is that I* is found mostly in the Balkans, but that some others throughout Europe bear it. If memory serves me correctly, I think Italy serves as a dividing line between I* and the extreme western I subclade, as neither are found on the other side of the Appenines.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Mikey
              Camoe,

              Do you have solid information where your oldest known paternal ancestor originated? My understanding is that I* is found mostly in the Balkans, but that some others throughout Europe bear it. If memory serves me correctly, I think Italy serves as a dividing line between I* and the extreme western I subclade, as neither are found on the other side of the Appenines.
              Thanks, and unfortunately I have no info on any paternal ancestor...makes the whole task a bit more daunting. I've not heard yet (just started researching this) of the geographic limits you mention and I'd better do some reading on that. I'm realizing how much more research I need to do. Thanks again.

              Comment


              • #8
                P40

                Originally posted by fmoakes
                I assume you saw my post on the "New Y-Hap I sub-clade structure" thread. I am still waiting for my deep SNP test for Hg I. You mention M21 and M72 for I1a2 and I1a3. What is your reaction to FTDNA dropping the P40 SNP test for I1a1? FTDNA's response to my question seems to stop short of a commitment to a separate test for P40 if both M21 and M72 are negative. I will be happy to share my SNP and STR data.
                Floyd Oakes
                There were several P30+ P40- results reported today on the Rootsweb List. I'm concerned that these P40- results really are indicative of "no test" rather than an ancestral result. Has anyone today received a haplogroup I deep SNP test result? Thanks,

                Phil Goff

                Comment


                • #9
                  P40 Tested

                  Hi Phil,

                  I received my deep SNP-I results today:

                  M161- M21- M223- M227- M26- M284- M72- P37.2- P40- P41.2- M170+ M253+ M258+ M307+ P19+ P30+ P38+

                  I was happy to see P40 was tested. If it hadn't been tested I do not believe it would have appeared on the list. I had expected to be P40+ (what used to be I1a1) but apparently I am I1a*. Maybe in the future more SNPs will become available. Currently I have 244 12/12 matches but no 25/25.

                  I can trace my paternal ancestor back to the Mulheim an der Ruhr area of Germany. As such, my ancestors can be either a local germanic tribe or Vikings who were also very active in the area about 1,100 years ago.

                  I look forward to seeing if anyone tested positive for P40!

                  John Bruggeman

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    P40,m284?????????

                    Originally posted by Johnserrat
                    Hi Phil,

                    I received my deep SNP-I results today:

                    M161- M21- M223- M227- M26- M284- M72- P37.2- P40- P41.2- M170+ M253+ M258+ M307+ P19+ P30+ P38+

                    I was happy to see P40 was tested. If it hadn't been tested I do not believe it would have appeared on the list. I had expected to be P40+ (what used to be I1a1) but apparently I am I1a*. Maybe in the future more SNPs will become available. Currently I have 244 12/12 matches but no 25/25.

                    I can trace my paternal ancestor back to the Mulheim an der Ruhr area of Germany. As such, my ancestors can be either a local germanic tribe or Vikings who were also very active in the area about 1,100 years ago.

                    I look forward to seeing if anyone tested positive for P40!

                    John Bruggeman
                    I have not received any results from my DeepSNP-I test (batch 132). However, it does NOT appear that FTDNA tested for P40 or M284, even though they are reporting (-) for these SNPs. The logic of this practice escapes me! http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/inde...GY-DNA/2006-02
                    Floyd Oakes
                    Last edited by fmoakes; 16 February 2006, 11:07 AM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      It would be grossly inappropriate to list results, negative or positive, if the tests were not actually done. What is the basis for your belief Floyd?

                      John

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        P40 Results have disappeared????

                        I cannot believe that FTDNA would list results and then withdraw them when customers begin to question whether the tests were actually done or not.

                        My faith in this company has been shattered.

                        John

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Johnserrat
                          I cannot believe that FTDNA would list results and then withdraw them when customers begin to question whether the tests were actually done or not.

                          My faith in this company has been shattered.

                          John
                          John,
                          I understand your reaction to this apparent gaff on the part of FTDNA. However, I am willing to wait for an explanation.
                          My current frustration is with the delay in the return of my deepSNP-I test results (batch 132). Since this is a totally new test area, I am willing to accept for now this response I received yesterday when I inquired about the delay:
                          "The results are starting to come back, but not in a rhythm nor reason that I expected. They should be along ion(sic) the next week or so."
                          Floyd

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Now missing M284, P40 and P41.2 results!

                            Gaff?! At this rate I wonder if I will have any results left to explain at all.

                            John

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Now missing M284, P40 and P41.2 results!

                              John

                              If you will look at the Deep Clade Test page, you will see that you did not order a test for markers M284, P40 and P41.2.

                              genny

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X