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  • jsarnacki
    replied
    Originally posted by dna View Post
    For better or worse, sisters are known to be overprotective... Sometimes...
    LOL.. Overprotective, sure... but this is a bit too Jerry Springer!

    Leave a comment:


  • dna
    replied
    Originally posted by RobertaMarques View Post
    I will say one thing: if someone gets my baby spit for any reason without my consent I would be REALLY mad.

    I think this person get a hobby and a place of her own, it is not her business who the child's father is. If her brother considers himself the father and is okay to raise the child, let him and the child be happy. Is she paying child support?

    If I were you, I would not help her AT ALL.
    For better or worse, sisters are known to be overprotective... Sometimes...

    Leave a comment:


  • RobertaMarques
    replied
    I will say one thing: if someone gets my baby spit for any reason without my consent I would be REALLY mad.

    I think this person get a hobby and a place of her own, it is not her business who the child's father is. If her brother considers himself the father and is okay to raise the child, let him and the child be happy. Is she paying child support?

    If I were you, I would not help her AT ALL.

    Leave a comment:


  • PeBe
    replied
    Originally posted by John McCoy View Post
    Sissela Bok's "Secrets: On the ethics of concealment and revelation" (1989, Vintage Books)
    That books sounds so interessting that I just ordered it by Amazon. Thank you for this hint.
    Last edited by PeBe; 23 June 2015, 01:45 AM.

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  • jsarnacki
    replied
    It is unethical, and perhaps even illegal (not that I would know) to do a DNA test on a minor without the parents consent. I would absolutely refuse to take part in anything like that. I would also let the parents know that this person has made the request of you. They should know that someone has the intent of testing their child without their knowledge so they can protect their child. Their child's DNA would be forever in a public forum once it is published with FTDNA or any other genealogy database. I have tested my kids (one adult, two minors...) but that was MY decision and my husbands and my KIDS wanted to do it. I would be livid if someone else made that decision for my children, no matter what the rationale.

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  • John McCoy
    replied
    Keep your nose clean!

    I have found Sissela Bok's "Secrets: On the ethics of concealment and revelation" (1989, Vintage Books) extremely helpful in sorting out issues of family secrets, who has a right to know, who has a right to keep a secret, who is harmed by keeping or revealing a secret, etc. It is extremely important for anyone, but especially a genealogist, to think clearly before wading into these problems. Helping someone wield power over another by submitting a DNA test without their knowledge doesn't sound like a good idea under any circumstances!

    Leave a comment:


  • K. L. Adams
    replied
    Originally posted by PeBe View Post
    It would for sure give her the peace of mind she is looking for. But my fear is that she will tell her brother, too... she does not like his wife.
    PeBe,

    I am a well know family researcher for my parents paternal and maternal Surname lines. Family members know that I will not disclose how I received information,and will do everything possible to protect research participants privacy. I am well known to keep it on the up and up, staying out of family politics.

    IMHO, I would advise to let the Aunt know that you respectively decline to participate, advise her to drop the ideal, and that you must stay within ethics guidelines.

    Now, if she decides to test herself then okay, no harm, no foul. On the other hand, the nephew is a hot potato and I would stay about 100 miles from that issue.

    Tell her the truth, if you go back far enough we are all brothers and sisters

    As I stated in the other thread, keep a "NO Kiss and Tell" policy, along with 3 primary rules in family research.

    1) Do no harm
    2) Do no harm
    3) Do no harm

    So, politely, very politely explain that you wish NOT to get involved in this matter. If she gets mad, move along to other research and let this dog lie for a while.

    Remember, a Genealogical and Genetic Family Researcher MUST maintain an excellent professional reputation amongst family members.

    Anyway, my 2 cents for what it is worth. Good luck!

    Best wishes, K. L. Adams

    Leave a comment:


  • dna
    replied
    Originally posted by andbro View Post
    We have a TV program in the UK for this kind of rubbish called the Jeremy Kyle show. It is none if the Aunts business.Someone should tell her that. Sounds like she has a big wooden spoon to me!
    May she is. Maybe she was only thinking that it would be better for her brother to have a proof (one way or another).

    She would not be the first person to be not aware of extremely negative consequences some highly advanced technology can bring to human relationships.

    W. (Mr.)

    Leave a comment:


  • LynCra
    replied
    Do not help her to do this. It would be wrong for her to fraudulently represent herself as legal guardian of the child if she submits at test without the knowledge of the parents.

    Leave a comment:


  • andbro
    replied
    Originally posted by dna View Post
    Please do more than just say no. Talk to her. Not about not doing the test, that is only a desired outcome. Talk about her brother feelings.He might be in love with his wife and his wife might love him too.


    That is why you have to talk to her about about not just some greater good, but about doing the good deeds in ones life. Taking care of all children is today considered one of the signs of humanity.

    I am stooping here, since it starts looking like a sermon, and I am not a priest.

    W. (Mr.)

    We have a TV program in the UK for this kind of rubbish called the Jeremy Kyle show. It is none if the Aunts business.Someone should tell her that. Sounds like she has a big wooden spoon to me!

    Leave a comment:


  • dna
    replied
    Originally posted by georgian1950 View Post
    Just say no and don't even give her any advice about vendors, tests, etc.
    Please do more than just say no. Talk to her. Not about not doing the test, that is only a desired outcome. Talk about her brother feelings.
    Originally posted by georgian1950 View Post
    Who knows, maybe your friend knows the truth and is at peace with it.
    He might be in love with his wife and his wife might love him too.

    Originally posted by georgian1950 View Post
    If she does it own her own, you will be judged guilty anyhow. I would keep as much distance from this scheme as possible.
    That is why you have to talk to her about about not just some greater good, but about doing the good deeds in ones life. Taking care of all children is today considered one of the signs of humanity.

    I am stooping here, since it starts looking like a sermon, and I am not a priest.

    W. (Mr.)

    Leave a comment:


  • georgian1950
    replied
    Just say no and don't even give her any advice about vendors, tests, etc.

    If she does it own her own, you will be judged guilty anyhow. I would keep as much distance from this scheme as possible.

    Who knows, maybe your friend knows the truth and is at peace with it.
    Last edited by georgian1950; 22 June 2015, 08:14 AM. Reason: additional content

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  • PeBe
    replied
    Originally posted by dna View Post
    It would be OK to help her with her own test, only. .

    Um, this is a way she (and I) did not thought about. So there is no way to avoid her finding it out.

    But wait a moment, even if she does not swab the child but herself she still needs some DNA either from the mother or the child to compare to her own DNA, right?

    Originally posted by dna View Post
    P.S.
    When talking to her, ask her what would happen next, if it is determined that she is not an aunt.
    Maybe she will change her testament as she earns quite a lot of money on her job, I really don't know.
    Last edited by PeBe; 22 June 2015, 08:10 AM.

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  • gtc
    replied
    Originally posted by PeBe View Post
    It would for sure give her the peace of mind she is looking for. But my fear is that she will tell her brother, too...
    That's the type of dilemma facing anybody who ventures into this stuff. In the end, it's your decision whether to go ahead and you deal with the consequences one way or the other.

    On the other hand, the woman could go ahead and do it under her own steam, and then it becomes her dilemma.

    Leave a comment:


  • dna
    replied
    Originally posted by PeBe View Post
    [----] And by the way, would FTDNA also get in trouble when performing an anonymous test?
    FTDNA tests carry no legal value in the US courts.

    W. (Mr.)

    Leave a comment:

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