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  • 1798
    replied
    Originally posted by Subwoofer View Post
    How about you show they inherited WHG from the Kent Cavern man. Indeed can you even demonstrate WHG is over 40,000 years old ?
    It is about time that some ancient remains were dna tested in the Isles and France and then we will see how they are related to modern western Europeans.

    Leave a comment:


  • Subwoofer
    replied
    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    Alright then, take your time, you tell me who Lochsbour,Motala and La Brana are descended from?
    How about you show they inherited WHG from the Kent Cavern man. Indeed can you even demonstrate WHG is over 40,000 years old ?

    Leave a comment:


  • 1798
    replied
    Originally posted by Subwoofer View Post
    Failed to find the reference then ? : ))))
    Alright then, take your time, you tell me who Lochsbour,Motala and La Brana are descended from?

    Leave a comment:


  • 1798
    replied
    Originally posted by Subwoofer View Post
    Not really, that's why he made K8
    I see, the K7 did not fit with the Yamnaya myth.

    Leave a comment:


  • Subwoofer
    replied
    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    Who do you think that the two ancient samples are descended from? Martians
    Failed to find the reference then ? : ))))

    Leave a comment:


  • Subwoofer
    replied
    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    The ANE calculator is accurate then.
    Not really, that's why he made K8

    Leave a comment:


  • 1798
    replied
    Originally posted by N21163 View Post
    Are you now attempting to state that these two samples are direct descendants of the Gravettians, without any outside influence, and the WHG component is indicative of Cro-Magnons and Gravettians?

    Based on what exactly?



    Please provide a reference (try a full reference too and not just an abstract )
    Who do you think that the two ancient samples are descended from? Martians

    Leave a comment:


  • 1798
    replied
    Originally posted by N21163 View Post
    The parts you bolded reflect the explanation of the WHG component I provided earlier in this thread: http://forums.familytreedna.com/show...08&postcount=5

    Data from this study was used in the creation of the Eurogenes ANE_K7 calculator and that is outlined in the Eurogenes post:

    http://eurogenes.blogspot.com.au/201...est-three.html

    You are attempting to use this article to support your claim but you have a cyclic argument.

    Here is the full article:

    http://biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/e...01552.full.pdf

    There is no mention of Cro-Magnon, Cro-Magnon samples, Cro-Magnon DNA or the WHG component representing Cro-Magnon DNA.

    There is also no mention of Gravettian or Ahmarian culture either.

    This does not help your original statement from your first post on this thread.
    The ANE calculator is accurate then.

    Leave a comment:


  • N21163
    replied
    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    Lochsbour and La Brana are descended from the Gravettians.
    Are you now attempting to state that these two samples are direct descendants of the Gravettians, without any outside influence, and the WHG component is indicative of Cro-Magnons and Gravettians?

    Based on what exactly?

    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    Was it not Lazaridis who linked WHG to the Gravettians?
    Please provide a reference (try a full reference too and not just an abstract )

    Leave a comment:


  • 1798
    replied
    Originally posted by N21163 View Post
    The parts you bolded reflect the explanation of the WHG component I provided earlier in this thread: http://forums.familytreedna.com/show...08&postcount=5

    Data from this study was used in the creation of the Eurogenes ANE_K7 calculator and that is outlined in the Eurogenes post:

    http://eurogenes.blogspot.com.au/201...est-three.html

    You are attempting to use this article to support your claim but you have a cyclic argument.

    Here is the full article:

    http://biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/e...01552.full.pdf

    There is no mention of Cro-Magnon, Cro-Magnon samples, Cro-Magnon DNA or the WHG component representing Cro-Magnon DNA.

    There is also no mention of Gravettian or Ahmarian culture either.

    This does not help your original statement from your first post on this thread.
    Lochsbour and La Brana are descended from the Gravettians. Was it not Lazaridis who linked WHG to the Gravettians?

    Leave a comment:


  • N21163
    replied
    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    http://biorxiv.org/content/early/2013/12/23/001552
    Abstract

    "Analysis of ancient DNA can reveal historical events that are difficult to discern through study of present-day individuals. To investigate European population history around the time of the agricultural transition, we sequenced complete genomes from a ~7,500 year old early farmer from the Linearbandkeramik (LBK) culture from Stuttgart in Germany and an ~8,000 year old hunter-gatherer from the Loschbour rock shelter in Luxembourg. We also generated data from seven ~8,000 year old hunter-gatherers from Motala in Sweden. We compared these genomes and published ancient DNA to new data from 2,196 samples from 185 diverse populations to show that at least three ancestral groups contributed to present-day Europeans. The first are Ancient North Eurasians (ANE), who are more closely related to Upper Paleolithic Siberians than to any present-day population. The second are West European Hunter-Gatherers (WHG), related to the Loschbour individual, who contributed to all Europeans but not to Near Easterners. The third are Early European Farmers (EEF), related to the Stuttgart individual, who were mainly of Near Eastern origin but also harbored WHG-related ancestry. We model the deep relationships of these populations and show that about ~44% of the ancestry of EEF derived from a basal Eurasian lineage that split prior to the separation of other non-Africans."
    The parts you bolded reflect the explanation of the WHG component I provided earlier in this thread: http://forums.familytreedna.com/show...08&postcount=5

    Data from this study was used in the creation of the Eurogenes ANE_K7 calculator and that is outlined in the Eurogenes post:

    http://eurogenes.blogspot.com.au/201...est-three.html

    You are attempting to use this article to support your claim but you have a cyclic argument.

    Here is the full article:

    http://biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/e...01552.full.pdf

    There is no mention of Cro-Magnon, Cro-Magnon samples, Cro-Magnon DNA or the WHG component representing Cro-Magnon DNA.

    There is also no mention of Gravettian or Ahmarian culture either.

    This does not help your original statement from your first post on this thread.
    Last edited by N21163; 5 July 2015, 06:27 AM.

    Leave a comment:


  • 1798
    replied
    Originally posted by N21163 View Post
    What?

    Provide a reference when I have stated that the admixture calculators support my line of thinking over research.

    You can't, as I have never stated such a thing.



    You are continuing to circle around the fact that you do not have any research to support your original statement.

    http://biorxiv.org/content/early/2013/12/23/001552
    Abstract

    "Analysis of ancient DNA can reveal historical events that are difficult to discern through study of present-day individuals. To investigate European population history around the time of the agricultural transition, we sequenced complete genomes from a ~7,500 year old early farmer from the Linearbandkeramik (LBK) culture from Stuttgart in Germany and an ~8,000 year old hunter-gatherer from the Loschbour rock shelter in Luxembourg. We also generated data from seven ~8,000 year old hunter-gatherers from Motala in Sweden. We compared these genomes and published ancient DNA to new data from 2,196 samples from 185 diverse populations to show that at least three ancestral groups contributed to present-day Europeans. The first are Ancient North Eurasians (ANE), who are more closely related to Upper Paleolithic Siberians than to any present-day population. The second are West European Hunter-Gatherers (WHG), related to the Loschbour individual, who contributed to all Europeans but not to Near Easterners. The third are Early European Farmers (EEF), related to the Stuttgart individual, who were mainly of Near Eastern origin but also harbored WHG-related ancestry. We model the deep relationships of these populations and show that about ~44% of the ancestry of EEF derived from a basal Eurasian lineage that split prior to the separation of other non-Africans."

    Leave a comment:


  • N21163
    replied
    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    So when the calculators don't fit with your line of thinking we should not use them.
    What?

    Provide a reference when I have stated that the admixture calculators support my line of thinking over research.

    You can't, as I have never stated such a thing.

    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    The reality is that we are descended from the first AMH or we would not be writing on this forum. DNA replication is 99.9% accurate.
    You are continuing to circle around the fact that you do not have any research to support your original statement.

    Leave a comment:


  • 1798
    replied
    Originally posted by N21163 View Post
    I stumbled across it a few years ago. A handy poster to have up in the office



    We have been through this before, the admixture calculator comparisons are not research.

    Thank you for reaffirming my points about your cyclic arguments.

    Like many other threads you have not advanced this one from your original post.
    So when the calculators don't fit with your line of thinking we should not use them. The reality is that we are descended from the first AMH or we would not be writing on this forum. DNA replication is 99.9% accurate.

    Leave a comment:


  • N21163
    replied
    Originally posted by hansonrf View Post
    I'm not smart enough to contribute but I have been watching this thread, trying to learn something, and you have provided this gem... A must-read for all Forum posters/users...

    Thanks!
    I stumbled across it a few years ago. A handy poster to have up in the office

    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    Eurogenes_ANE K7 Admixture Proportions
    La Brana
    Population
    ANE 3.98%
    ASE 0.45%
    WHG-UHG 92.37%
    East_Eurasian 2.31%
    West_African 0.86%
    East_African -
    ENF -

    Lochsbour
    Population
    ANE 7.35%
    ASE 0.49%
    WHG-UHG 88.70%
    East_Eurasian 3.09%
    West_African -
    East_African 0.36%
    ENF -

    Comparing Kit F999918 (Loschbour, Lux., 8ky) and F999915 (La Brana, Spain, 7ky)
    Largest segment = 3.8 cM
    Total of segments > 1.5 cM = 185.3 cM
    We have been through this before, the admixture calculator comparisons are not research.

    Thank you for reaffirming my points about your cyclic arguments.

    Like many other threads you have not advanced this one from your original post.
    Last edited by N21163; 4 July 2015, 10:32 PM.

    Leave a comment:

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