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Karelia_HG 5500-5000 BCE C1g R1a1

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  • Karelia_HG 5500-5000 BCE C1g R1a1

    K15
    Population
    North_Sea 24.27%
    Atlantic 0.40%
    Baltic 16.96%
    Eastern_Euro 43.13%
    West_Med -
    West_Asian -
    East_Med -
    Red_Sea -
    South_Asian -
    Southeast_Asian -
    Siberian -
    Amerindian 15.25%
    Oceanian -
    Northeast_African -
    Sub-Saharan -

    Using 4 populations approximation:
    1 Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 18.182165
    2 MA-1+Mari+Motala12+Motala12 @ 18.581502
    3 Erzya+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 18.998078
    4 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Motala12 @ 19.05268
    5 Kargopol_Russian+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 19.625204
    6 Chuvash+Erzya+MA-1+Motala12 @ 19.713645
    7 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Saami_Finland @ 19.870249
    8 MA-1+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.032809
    9 Erzya+Erzya+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.099876
    10 Chuvash+Kargopol_Russian+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.157684
    11 Chuvash+Estonian+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.238874
    12 East_Finnish+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.252028
    13 Erzya+MA-1+Mari+Motala12 @ 20.268367
    14 Chuvash+East_Finnish+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.487915
    15 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Southwest_Russian @ 20.501007
    16 Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12+Southwest_Russian @ 20.524959
    17 Chuvash+Lithuanian+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.525725
    18 Erzya+Kargopol_Russian+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.570076
    19 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 20.596127
    20 Estonian+MA-1+Mari+Motala12 @ 20.597034
    21 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Tatar @ 20.597245
    22 Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12+Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 20.63554
    23 Kargopol_Russian+MA-1+Mari+Motala12 @ 20.684419
    24 Chuvash+Estonian_Polish+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.720606
    25 Chuvash+Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.726319
    26 Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12+Ukrainian @ 20.746503
    27 Estonian+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.77407
    28 Chuvash+Mayan+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.781543
    29 Belorussian+Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.788991
    30 Mari+Mayan+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.800008
    31 East_Finnish+Erzya+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.806427
    32 Lithuanian+MA-1+Mari+Motala12 @ 20.83542
    33 Estonian_Polish+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.835668
    34 Chuvash+Finnish+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.879375


    Eurogenes_ANE K7 Admixture Proportions
    Population
    ANE 37.52%
    ASE 3.63%
    WHG-UHG 55.15%
    East_Eurasian 3.70%
    West_African -
    East_African -
    ENF -

  • #2
    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
    K15
    Population
    North_Sea 24.27%
    Atlantic 0.40%
    Baltic 16.96%
    Eastern_Euro 43.13%
    West_Med -
    West_Asian -
    East_Med -
    Red_Sea -
    South_Asian -
    Southeast_Asian -
    Siberian -
    Amerindian 15.25%
    Oceanian -
    Northeast_African -
    Sub-Saharan -

    Using 4 populations approximation:
    1 Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 18.182165
    2 MA-1+Mari+Motala12+Motala12 @ 18.581502
    3 Erzya+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 18.998078
    4 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Motala12 @ 19.05268
    5 Kargopol_Russian+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 19.625204
    6 Chuvash+Erzya+MA-1+Motala12 @ 19.713645
    7 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Saami_Finland @ 19.870249
    8 MA-1+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.032809
    9 Erzya+Erzya+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.099876
    10 Chuvash+Kargopol_Russian+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.157684
    11 Chuvash+Estonian+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.238874
    12 East_Finnish+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.252028
    13 Erzya+MA-1+Mari+Motala12 @ 20.268367
    14 Chuvash+East_Finnish+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.487915
    15 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Southwest_Russian @ 20.501007
    16 Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12+Southwest_Russian @ 20.524959
    17 Chuvash+Lithuanian+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.525725
    18 Erzya+Kargopol_Russian+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.570076
    19 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 20.596127
    20 Estonian+MA-1+Mari+Motala12 @ 20.597034
    21 MA-1+Motala12+Motala12+Tatar @ 20.597245
    22 Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12+Ukrainian_Belgorod @ 20.63554
    23 Kargopol_Russian+MA-1+Mari+Motala12 @ 20.684419
    24 Chuvash+Estonian_Polish+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.720606
    25 Chuvash+Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.726319
    26 Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12+Ukrainian @ 20.746503
    27 Estonian+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.77407
    28 Chuvash+Mayan+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.781543
    29 Belorussian+Chuvash+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.788991
    30 Mari+Mayan+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.800008
    31 East_Finnish+Erzya+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.806427
    32 Lithuanian+MA-1+Mari+Motala12 @ 20.83542
    33 Estonian_Polish+MA-1+Motala12+Motala12 @ 20.835668
    34 Chuvash+Finnish+MA-1+Motala12 @ 20.879375


    Eurogenes_ANE K7 Admixture Proportions
    Population
    ANE 37.52%
    ASE 3.63%
    WHG-UHG 55.15%
    East_Eurasian 3.70%
    West_African -
    East_African -
    ENF -
    How did someone in eastern Europe get so much WHG? There must have been an ancient west to east migration.

    Comment


    • #3
      Or maybe WHG was never constrained to the west ...

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by MikeP View Post
        Or maybe WHG was never constrained to the west ...
        It does not matter. The 64% WHG that is showing in Irish people today did not occur 4,500 ybp.

        Comment


        • #5
          Unetice, German F 10047 2,022-1937 BC.

          ANE and K15 results.

          Unetice
          Population *
          ANE 16.25%
          ASE - * *
          WHG-UHG 71.33%
          East_Eurasian - * *
          West_African 0.30%
          East_African - * *
          ENF 12.11%


          Population *
          North_Sea 34.99%
          Atlantic 36.93%
          Baltic 11.91%
          Eastern_Euro 9.33%
          West_Med 4.19%
          West_Asian 2.65%
          East_Med - * *
          Red_Sea - * *
          South_Asian - * *
          Southeast_Asian - * *
          Siberian - * *
          Amerindian - * *
          Oceanian - * *
          Northeast_African - * *
          Sub-Saharan

          Using 4 populations approximation:
          1 Irish + Irish + Irish + Irish @ 7.359780
          2 Irish + Irish + Irish + West_Scottish @ 7.406608
          3 Irish + Irish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.473263
          4 Irish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.559216
          5 West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.663819
          6 Irish + Irish + Irish + Southeast_English @ 7.746123
          7 Irish + Irish + Southeast_English + West_Scottish @ 7.790779
          8 Irish + Southeast_English + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.854320
          9 Danish + Irish + Irish + Irish @ 7.858067
          10 Irish + Irish + Irish + North_German @ 7.894940
          11 Irish + Irish + North_German + West_Scottish @ 7.916199
          12 Danish + Irish + Irish + West_Scottish @ 7.923547
          13 Southeast_English + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.936294
          14 Irish + North_German + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.953793
          15 Irish + Irish + Irish + Orcadian @ 8.003642
          16 Danish + Irish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 8.005489
          17 North_German + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 8.008284
          18 Irish + Irish + Orcadian + West_Scottish @ 8.088053
          19 Danish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 8.108608
          20 Irish + Irish + Irish + North_Dutch @ 8.131166

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by 1798 View Post
            Unetice, German F 10047 2,022-1937 BC.

            ANE and K15 results.

            Unetice
            Population *
            ANE 16.25%
            ASE - * *
            WHG-UHG 71.33%
            East_Eurasian - * *
            West_African 0.30%
            East_African - * *
            ENF 12.11%


            Population *
            North_Sea 34.99%
            Atlantic 36.93%
            Baltic 11.91%
            Eastern_Euro 9.33%
            West_Med 4.19%
            West_Asian 2.65%
            East_Med - * *
            Red_Sea - * *
            South_Asian - * *
            Southeast_Asian - * *
            Siberian - * *
            Amerindian - * *
            Oceanian - * *
            Northeast_African - * *
            Sub-Saharan

            Using 4 populations approximation:
            1 Irish + Irish + Irish + Irish @ 7.359780
            2 Irish + Irish + Irish + West_Scottish @ 7.406608
            3 Irish + Irish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.473263
            4 Irish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.559216
            5 West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.663819
            6 Irish + Irish + Irish + Southeast_English @ 7.746123
            7 Irish + Irish + Southeast_English + West_Scottish @ 7.790779
            8 Irish + Southeast_English + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.854320
            9 Danish + Irish + Irish + Irish @ 7.858067
            10 Irish + Irish + Irish + North_German @ 7.894940
            11 Irish + Irish + North_German + West_Scottish @ 7.916199
            12 Danish + Irish + Irish + West_Scottish @ 7.923547
            13 Southeast_English + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.936294
            14 Irish + North_German + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 7.953793
            15 Irish + Irish + Irish + Orcadian @ 8.003642
            16 Danish + Irish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 8.005489
            17 North_German + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 8.008284
            18 Irish + Irish + Orcadian + West_Scottish @ 8.088053
            19 Danish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish + West_Scottish @ 8.108608
            20 Irish + Irish + Irish + North_Dutch @ 8.131166
            These results show that there was no input from the Steppe 4,200 ybp in the region where this woman died.

            Comment


            • #7
              Corded Ware

              CWC 2,566-2,477 BC 10103
              Corded Ware 10103
              Population * *
              ANE 24.68%
              ASE 2.46%
              WHG-UHG 59.61%
              East_Eurasian - * *
              West_African 0.62%
              East_African 0.08%
              ENF 12.55%


              Population * *
              North_Sea 34.41%
              Atlantic 20.82%
              Baltic 8.70%
              Eastern_Euro 20.14%
              West_Med - * *
              West_Asian 13.18%
              East_Med - * *
              Red_Sea - * *
              South_Asian 0.47%
              Southeast_Asian - * *
              Siberian - * *
              Amerindian 2.28%
              Oceanian - * *
              Northeast_African - * *
              Sub-Saharan - * *

              Using 4 populations approximation:
              1 North_Swedish + North_Swedish + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 9.606257
              2 North_Swedish + North_Swedish + Orcadian + Tabassaran @ 9.743698
              3 North_Swedish + North_Swedish + Tabassaran + West_Scottish @ 9.774204
              4 Danish + North_Swedish + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 9.811347
              5 North_Swedish + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian + West_Norwegian @ 9.827334
              6 North_Swedish + North_Swedish + Norwegian + Tabassaran @ 9.857185
              7 Danish + North_Swedish + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 9.905888
              8 North_Swedish + Norwegian + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 9.909755
              9 Southwest_Finnish + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian + West_Norwegian @ 9.913658
              10 North_Swedish + North_Swedish + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 9.940525
              11 East_Finnish + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian + West_Norwegian @ 9.982730
              12 East_Finnish + Orcadian + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 10.033775
              13 North_Swedish + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian + West_Scottish @ 10.040244
              14 Irish + North_Swedish + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 10.047202
              15 North_Dutch + North_Swedish + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 10.060412
              16 North_Swedish + Norwegian + Norwegian + Tabassaran @ 10.062361
              17 Danish + North_Swedish + Norwegian + Tabassaran @ 10.076385
              18 North_Swedish + Orcadian + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 10.130554
              19 North_Swedish + Southwest_Finnish + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 10.142609
              20 North_Swedish + Swedish + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 10.149682

              This woman's ancestors were a mixture of northern European and eastern European. Her MTDNA W6a is probably from western Asia. She could be 50/50.

              Comment


              • #8
                "It seems apparent that the Loschbour, Luxembourg Hunter-Gatherer was related to the La BraƱa Hunter-Gatherers. However, reindeer went extinct in the Northern Europe plain 11,250 years ago and in Scandanavia 10,300 years ago (Link). Therefore, the Loschbour Man was not a reindeer hunter. However, based on the evidence of reindeer remains during the Upper Paleolithic in the Paris Basin, the British Isles and Germany, it is very likely that many of Loschbour Man's ancestors were reindeer hunters."

                The Paris Basin could be the origin place of L11. That is my view.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Yamnaya

                  Yamnaya 10429
                  Eurogenes K15
                  North_Sea 29.55
                  Atlantic 1.62
                  Baltic 12.2
                  Eastern_Euro 26.14
                  West_Med 0
                  West_Asian 17.96
                  East_Med 0
                  Red_Sea 0
                  South_Asian 7.37
                  Southeast_Asian 0
                  Siberian 0
                  Amerindian 5.16
                  Oceanian 0
                  Northeast_African 0
                  Sub-Saharan 0


                  This ancient yamnaya sample shows that there was two way traffic between western Europe and the Steppe. The North Sea autosomal dna is specific to the North Sea and I believe that it is ancient dna from Doggerland.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by 1798 View Post
                    Yamnaya 10429
                    Eurogenes K15
                    North_Sea 29.55
                    Atlantic 1.62
                    Baltic 12.2
                    Eastern_Euro 26.14
                    West_Med 0
                    West_Asian 17.96
                    East_Med 0
                    Red_Sea 0
                    South_Asian 7.37
                    Southeast_Asian 0
                    Siberian 0
                    Amerindian 5.16
                    Oceanian 0
                    Northeast_African 0
                    Sub-Saharan 0


                    This ancient yamnaya sample shows that there was two way traffic between western Europe and the Steppe. The North Sea autosomal dna is specific to the North Sea and I believe that it is ancient dna from Doggerland.
                    I'm curious, why Doggerland specifically?

                    o these algorithms say that the "North Sea" component represents Doggerland outright?

                    Are these admixture calculators entirely accurate with their representation of these components?

                    Is there a table that states the percentages commonly found in certain ethnicities?

                    *Please note this is an attempt to engage you in discussion and I ask that you please provide links for any material you may reference.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by N21163 View Post
                      I'm curious, why Doggerland specifically?

                      o these algorithms say that the "North Sea" component represents Doggerland outright?

                      Are these admixture calculators entirely accurate with their representation of these components?

                      Is there a table that states the percentages commonly found in certain ethnicities?

                      *Please note this is an attempt to engage you in discussion and I ask that you please provide links for any material you may reference.
                      I wrote that I believe that the north sea component is the autosomal dna related to doggerland, because the HG Motala 12 had this dna type.

                      I don't know of a table that states the percentages commonly found in certain ethnicities?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Here is the k15 results of one of the ancient Yamnaya, gedmatch ID M951285 (10231)

                        Population * *
                        ANE 35.26%
                        ASE 4.10%
                        WHG-UHG 53.76%
                        East_Eurasian - * *
                        West_African 0.31%
                        East_African - * *
                        ENF 6.57%


                        Population * *
                        North_Sea 28.14%
                        Atlantic 4.42%
                        Baltic 11.27%
                        Eastern_Euro 33.52%
                        West_Med - * *
                        West_Asian 14.93%
                        East_Med - * *
                        Red_Sea - * *
                        South_Asian 4.06%
                        Southeast_Asian - * *
                        Siberian - * *
                        Amerindian 3.66%
                        Oceanian - * *
                        Northeast_African - * *
                        Sub-Saharan - * *

                        Using 4 populations approximation:
                        1 Chuvash + Erzya + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 16.525211
                        2 Chuvash + Chuvash + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 16.584866
                        3 Chuvash + Erzya + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 16.619112
                        4 Chuvash + Chuvash + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 16.664843
                        5 Chuvash + Chuvash + Norwegian + Tabassaran @ 16.729088
                        6 Chuvash + Erzya + Norwegian + Tabassaran @ 16.742262
                        7 Chuvash + Chuvash + Swedish + Tabassaran @ 16.760130
                        8 Erzya + Mari + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 16.828409
                        9 Erzya + Mari + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 16.857485
                        10 Chuvash + Kargopol_Russian + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 16.873384
                        11 Chuvash + Erzya + Swedish + Tabassaran @ 16.883747
                        12 Erzya + Mari + Norwegian + Tabassaran @ 16.980738
                        13 Chuvash + East_Finnish + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 16.991219
                        14 Erzya + Mari + Swedish + Tabassaran @ 17.099211
                        15 Chuvash + Kargopol_Russian + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 17.109724
                        16 Kargopol_Russian + Mari + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 17.180006
                        17 Chuvash + Kargopol_Russian + Norwegian + Tabassaran @ 17.189167
                        18 Erzya + MA-1 + Tabassaran + West_Norwegian @ 17.222752
                        19 Chuvash + East_Finnish + East_Finnish + Tabassaran @ 17.255564
                        20 Erzya + MA-1 + North_Swedish + Tabassaran @ 17.266594
                        Last edited by 1798; 8 March 2015, 03:44 PM. Reason: mistake

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          The spreadsheet for K15 averages of world populations and some ancient specimens can be found at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1872836177

                          The Haak et al. specimens are in different spreadsheets at https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...#gid=917906623 and https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1351765170

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Does this need its own thread? It looks like the data provided in the preceding thread, I will go ahead and combine them for now.

                            -Darren
                            Family Tree DNA

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Population Irish average
                              North_Sea 36.38%
                              Atlantic 30.66%
                              Baltic 11.15%
                              Eastern_Euro 8.12%
                              West_Med 6.98%
                              West_Asian 6.98%
                              East_Med 1.24%
                              Red_Sea 0.67%
                              South_Asian 55.00%
                              Southeast_Asian - * *
                              Siberian 0.05%
                              Amerindian 0.60%
                              Oceanian 0.01%
                              Northeast_African 0.07%
                              Sub-Saharan 0.04%

                              Comment

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