Gedmatch no longer accepting FTDNA kits

[Darren]

Hello,

I have been reporting how displeased members have been over this and those that have chosen to discontinue their relationship with Family Tree DNA. I am trying to make your voices heard with management.

One thing I wanted to point out regarding issue 4 in the face book post, apparently you can only see the terms of service for gedmatch after you log in. There is nothing posted on just gedmatch.com or on the registration page. Not trying to make excuses, was just hoping to clarify this one issue.

-Darren
Family Tree DNA

[RobM]

If Gedmatch removes FTDNA from their site, what then is the point of GedMatch? Ancestry testers having a few tools to use.
Should Gedmatch remove FTDNA from their site then FTDNA should offer free uploads to all Ancestry and 23 and Me customers plus add a few extra comparison tools for us to use.

End result would be Gedmatch no longer exists.

Therefore I don't think Gedmatch will remove current FTDNA uploaded data unless they are forced to and FTDNA are playing a strategic battle here.

[RAD]

FTDNA wants their own GEDMATCH... profit oriented of course

[Dora]

Why so suddenly and out of nowhere? Strange. How many years Ftdna clients were using Gedmatch? I've just started using it few days ago and now it is over...

[phx2128]

Hello,

I have been reporting how displeased members have been over this and those that have chosen to discontinue their relationship with Family Tree DNA. I am trying to make your voices heard with management.

One thing I wanted to point out regarding issue 4 in the face book post, apparently you can only see the terms of service for gedmatch after you log in. There is nothing posted on just gedmatch.com or on the registration page. Not trying to make excuses, was just hoping to clarify this one issue.


-Darren
Family Tree DNA

It isn't hidden from you till AFTER you upload a kit. The user has the full capability of informed consent prior to loading at DNA data at Gedmatch.

Darren -- We appreciate your advocacy. As you can see, this is a very emotive topic. Tandem utilization of all these tools have become a very effective methodology for many researchers. With regard to Issue 4, it is true, you don't see the terms of service until you've established your account at Gedmatch. However, you do see it as soon as you establish an account (which only requires a validated email address) and can elect to never upload a DNA kit at that point or certainly remove one if you have uploaded and aren't comfortable with how the site works. Not sure what the big issue is with this point.

[phje]

Darren,

Thank you for your reply. If it were not for your attention to the forums I would feel as if no one at FTDNA truly empathized with their customers.

I do, however, have a question.

You stated:

It is my understanding that it was Gedmatch's choice to suspend uploads until the specific issues can be resolved.

Last night on Facebook FTDNA posted:

We have reached out to GEDMatch expressing our concern that their website could potentially lead to a breach in privacy of our customers. Given this, we proposed to discuss the subject with them, but in parallel we suggested that until further clarification and assurances that the privacy of our customers' records are protected, Family Tree DNA uploads should be suspended. We hope that with the cooperation of GEDMatch we can reestablish the uploads in the near future.

So which is it? In a he said, she said situation it’s best not to be caught in a contradiction.

[loobster]

Devil's advocate possibly -
If FTDNA possibly IS AWARE of a way under the current setup that privacy can be breached - I personally feel that not spelling that procedure out publicly is actually an appropriate stance. I really prefer they NOT tell folks how to breach others' privacy.

At least twice I went to upload Kits to GedMatch and ran into messages that it was not accepting new Kits at that time. Now this.
Wondering --
Does GedMatch in any way list/access/display (any of those) your Matches at FTDNA? Is it in any way making use of FTDNA's Database - or just your raw data?

[phx2128]

Agree with the previous post that no one wants a manual published as to how to breach a FTDNA account. However, I cannot help but feel that it is a convenient statement to throw out there and then effectively hide behind for the very same reason.

No one has access to raw DNA files at Gedmatch. As a user who has uploaded a file, you cannot even download that file in the future. You can only delete the file.

As to seeing FTDNA matches, I only see the matches for others at FTDNA who have uploaded their kits to Gedmatch. BTW, they can see all my matches as well. I cannot see any of their matches from FTDNA that aren't a Gedmatch user. So, in my opinion, Gedmatch doesn't utilize the FTDNA site at all.

[The_Contemplator]

Well if there is an actual flaw, it makes sense FTDNA wouldn't spell it out until it gets patched up. However, due to how poorly they sometimes communicate with their customers, it gets pretty easy to assume FTDNA is lying or exaggerating. So now you have a bunch of people curious and actually looking for the the supposed flaw which they may find.

Maybe it isn't any one little problem they have with Gedmatch but multiple things that aren't really issues alone. FTDNA could be afraid of such things being used against them through a lawsuit. If they lose that lawsuit they are dealing with in Alaska, it could cost them many thousands of dollars.

The timing seems odd though. Anyone else noticed YFull is doing some sort of move right now and is currently set to read-only until they are done?

Anyways as to what problem it could be, maybe FTDNA is afraid someone will do some phishing. Not everyone would fall for it, but not all users even know what is phishing or how to spot it. Once someone gets access to a FTDNA kit, they would have the address and phone number of a person. Not much of an issue if your interest is just genealogy, but others wouldn't feel comfortable with the thought that strangers know where they live or that they could call them.

[hudsonh]

Gedmatch

Oh dear, If I were FTDNA I think I would be more concerned about a class action lawsuit from customers objecting to a company's decision to control the use of their product after it is sold.

[A.Morup]

My 5 cents

I think it goes as simple as this:

In FTDNA everything in the Y-DNA groups is public, because the only personal data published is most distant male ancestor (deceased) and kit number.

In FF match you get to see the names of the tested person, but NOT the kit number.

You can not link a kit number to the person tested on FTDNA.

When a kit is uploaded to GedMatch you can link the informations above (kit number and name of living tested person).

With those keys, you can read exact Y-DNA profile of a tested person form FTDNA public information (groups).

If this post is moderated, I am right!

[192971]

Maybe it is a problem that some project admins do not realize that even if somebody allows an admin to download their raw data, it still does not extend so that the admin is free to upload their raw data to any third party system without a specific permission?

[Armando]

Hello,

I have been reporting how displeased members have been over this and those that have chosen to discontinue their relationship with Family Tree DNA. I am trying to make your voices heard with management.

One thing I wanted to point out regarding issue 4 in the face book post, apparently you can only see the terms of service for gedmatch after you log in. There is nothing posted on just gedmatch.com or on the registration page. Not trying to make excuses, was just hoping to clarify this one issue.

-Darren
Family Tree DNA

Thank you for reporting the displeasure.

The Site Policy Statement is readily available before a person ever uploads an autosomal file.

[Armando]

I think it goes as simple as this:

In FTDNA everything in the Y-DNA groups is public, because the only personal data published is most distant male ancestor (deceased) and kit number.

In FF match you get to see the names of the tested person, but NOT the kit number.

You can not link a kit number to the person tested on FTDNA.

When a kit is uploaded to GedMatch you can link the informations above (kit number and name of living tested person).

With those keys, you can read exact Y-DNA profile of a tested person form FTDNA public information (groups).

If this post is moderated, I am right!

That is what most other people are speculating. I think it is more than just the name and kit number.

Many people are arguing that they knew about that when they uploaded their DNA, they know what can be gleaned, and it was their choice to do so and FTDNA shouldn't be telling them what to do with their DNA.

[LarryBurford]

I am glad I saw this. I have two cousins that were going to order FF tests this week. I told them to now order from Ancestry. I had tested a lot of family members at Ancestry before I started testing at FTDNA. I love the Y testing at FTDNA and have spent a LOT of money testing several different lines of my family. I Just got my Grandmothers brother who is 85 and in bad health to do a Y test. I really wanted to test him at ancestry for autosomal DNA but decided to do FF at the same time I did the Y test because I knew I could upload his results to Gedmatch to compare to all the other family members that I had uploaded there from Ancestry. This screws everything up I had planned. Now if I want to compare I will have to spend another $112.50 and order an ancestry kit for my Great Uncle from Ancestry.