Go Back   Family Tree DNA Forums > Universal Lineage Testing (Autosomal DNA) > myOrigins Basics

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 15th January 2017, 05:06 AM
malchik malchik is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 162
Asia Minor DNA

Some test takers have some percentage of Asia Minor DNA showing up in their results.

I think it is rather funny that people with ancestors from Europe suddenly start thinking about their connections with modern-day Turkey, while others suspect of middle-age connections with Sephardic Jews and some even speculate ancient connections with Hittites...


Where does the reference for comparison come from?

What is the Asia Minor DNA really indicating?

What is the Asia Minor DNA really NOT indicating?

Why is it actually labeled Asia Minor?

How is it labeled in other DNA tests?


Basic questions in the my MyOrigins Basics forum...

Please share your thoughts, maybe some scientific data and of course their sources.

Last edited by malchik; 15th January 2017 at 05:07 AM. Reason: spelling
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 15th January 2017, 08:40 AM
Armando Armando is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,672
I find over and over that 23andme has results that most closely match well documented genealogy.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 15th January 2017, 02:02 PM
MMaddi MMaddi is offline
yDNA: R-CTS2509; mtDNA: T2e
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 3,387
Quote:
Originally Posted by Armando View Post
I find over and over that 23andme has results that most closely match well documented genealogy.
I agree with Armando on this. I would add that the Asia Minor category in myOrigins does seem problematic and subject to speculation.

However, it is the case that FTDNA has explained in public presentations that they've designed myOrigins to pick up ancient ancestry, on the order of 1,000 to several thousand years ago. 23andMe, on the other hand, designed their Ancestry Composition feature to hone in on the last 500 years of ancestry. That's one reason why 23andMe's admixture estimates more accurately reflect the paper trail ancestry of their customers.

Given that those with Italian ancestry are consistently given significantly higher percentages of Asia Minor than those with northern European ancestry, this probably reflects the strong genetic influence in Italy from the Neolithic to as recently as 1,000 years ago from Middle Eastern populations, including from Asia Minor. So, it's certainly plausible that the percentages of Asia Minor given my myOrigins does reflect someone's ancestry, but very deep ancestry. Still, it is a problem that it's misleading to people who take it at face value and begin looking for mystery Middle Eastern ancestry in their tree.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 20th January 2017, 04:20 PM
malchik malchik is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 162
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMaddi View Post
I agree with Armando on this. I would add that the Asia Minor category in myOrigins does seem problematic and subject to speculation.

However, it is the case that FTDNA has explained in public presentations that they've designed myOrigins to pick up ancient ancestry, on the order of 1,000 to several thousand years ago. 23andMe, on the other hand, designed their Ancestry Composition feature to hone in on the last 500 years of ancestry. That's one reason why 23andMe's admixture estimates more accurately reflect the paper trail ancestry of their customers.

Given that those with Italian ancestry are consistently given significantly higher percentages of Asia Minor than those with northern European ancestry, this probably reflects the strong genetic influence in Italy from the Neolithic to as recently as 1,000 years ago from Middle Eastern populations, including from Asia Minor. So, it's certainly plausible that the percentages of Asia Minor given my myOrigins does reflect someone's ancestry, but very deep ancestry. Still, it is a problem that it's misleading to people who take it at face value and begin looking for mystery Middle Eastern ancestry in their tree.
I liked your post, it is very informative. Thank you.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 20th June 2017, 07:45 PM
Laurie_Robinson Laurie_Robinson is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 20
Hello;

So if I'm reading your correctly my MO2 results of:

British Isles: 46%
Scandinavian 22%
West/Central European 15%
Southeastern European 9%
Asia Minor 5%

could actually be picking up a deep ancestry migration route from pre-Turkic (perhaps even pre-Greek/Byzantine) Asia Minor into Europe that goes back thousands of years?

My known ancestry from three grand parents is Scottish, Luxembourgish and Norwegian. The fourth is adopted so unknown, but assumed European origins.

I am fascinated by that 9% South Eastern European and 5% Asia Minor ancestry and how recent it could possibly be. Any thoughts?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 20th June 2017, 08:42 PM
MMaddi MMaddi is offline
yDNA: R-CTS2509; mtDNA: T2e
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 3,387
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laurie_Robinson View Post
Hello;

So if I'm reading your correctly my MO2 results of:

British Isles: 46%
Scandinavian 22%
West/Central European 15%
Southeastern European 9%
Asia Minor 5%

could actually be picking up a deep ancestry migration route from pre-Turkic (perhaps even pre-Greek/Byzantine) Asia Minor into Europe that goes back thousands of years?

My known ancestry from three grand parents is Scottish, Luxembourgish and Norwegian. The fourth is adopted so unknown, but assumed European origins.

I am fascinated by that 9% South Eastern European and 5% Asia Minor ancestry and how recent it could possibly be. Any thoughts?
With one grandparent adopted, it's hard to say. The combined 14% Southeastern Europe/Asia Minor could represent about half of the ancestry of the adopted grandparent, which might be Italian (more likely) or Greek. Or it could represent deep ancestry combined from all four grandparents.

The biggest problem is that the new version of myOrigins seems to be right on the mark for some, but totally off the mark for others. It doesn't seem to have a lot of consistency or reliability. There are numerous threads on this board that you can read about the problem.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 20th June 2017, 10:03 PM
vinnie vinnie is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,599
I cannot respond in reference to MO v2, but modern Armenians, not modern Turks, were the reference population for the Asia Minor component. MO v1 supposedly represented up to 2K years ago, but I don't know what time span v2 is supposed to represent.

Last edited by vinnie; 20th June 2017 at 10:08 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 21st June 2017, 02:45 PM
Tmason Tmason is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: U.K.
Posts: 97
I found this interesting. My brother and I are showing 9% and 8% Asia Minor, respectively.

Until recently, my mother, who is of Ashkenazi descent, hadn't been tested, so I just assumed the "Asia Minor" stuff came from her Jewish heritage. But when she was tested, she didn't have any Asia Minor, so it must have come from my father's side. But they are "British" as far back as I've been able to trace, so I don't know why anyone should be showing a non-trivial Asia Minor component.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 21st June 2017, 02:55 PM
MMaddi MMaddi is offline
yDNA: R-CTS2509; mtDNA: T2e
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 3,387
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmason View Post
I found this interesting. My brother and I are showing 9% and 8% Asia Minor, respectively.

Until recently, my mother, who is of Ashkenazi descent, hadn't been tested, so I just assumed the "Asia Minor" stuff came from her Jewish heritage. But when she was tested, she didn't have any Asia Minor, so it must have come from my father's side. But they are "British" as far back as I've been able to trace, so I don't know why anyone should be showing a non-trivial Asia Minor component.
You may be experiencing what I described as a serious problem with myOrigins 2.0 in my previous post above: "The biggest problem is that the new version of myOrigins seems to be right on the mark for some, but totally off the mark for others. It doesn't seem to have a lot of consistency or reliability. There are numerous threads on this board that you can read about the problem."

In your case, with no known ancestry that comes from southern or southeastern Europe, you may be seeing the reliability problem of the estimates or the Asia Minor may represent deep ancestry that is being picked up. The previous version of myOrigins did specify that estimates could reflect ancestry from up to several thousand years ago. Perhaps the new version is doing the same in some cases.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 21st June 2017, 03:43 PM
Tmason Tmason is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: U.K.
Posts: 97
Hmmm. I just checked what I used to be under MO 1. I was still 5% Asia Minor according to that. So it's actually gone up!

I don't know if either estimate is (a) a problem, (b) something very ancient that need not concern us when researching recent ancestors, or (c) something more recent that we just don't know.

I know looks are one of the least reliable or scientific methods for estimating anyone's ancestry, but my father and his mother were unusually dark-skinned, for northern Europeans. If they had been presented as "part-Turkish", I don't believe anybody would have questioned it for a minute. They were darker than my Jewish family!

In the British New Year tradition of "first footing", where the darkest available adult male for some reason carries a lump of coal through the house, the honour always fell to my dad.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Help. Asia Minor DNA in Italians Anizio myOrigins Basics 61 13th April 2017 09:39 PM
Iranian with 7% British Isles and 38% Asia Minor?? EPersia myOrigins Basics 4 31st August 2016 07:37 PM
Asia Minor? owen1218 DNA and Genealogy for Beginners 64 7th March 2016 07:16 PM
5% Asia Minor? wilson myOrigins Basics 2 20th June 2015 11:17 PM
Can Asia Minor in myOrigins suggest Jewish ancestry? schnook myOrigins Basics 3 18th April 2015 07:26 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:43 AM.


Family Tree DNA - World Headquarters

1445 North Loop West, Suite 820
Houston, Texas 77008, USA

Phone: (713) 868-1438 | Fax: (832) 201-7147
Copyright 2001-2010 Genealogy by Genetics, Ltd.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.