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  #21  
Old 27th August 2006, 09:57 AM
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casadecoqui casadecoqui is offline
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Greg and all members:

I'm always looking for any new articles. If I can get them, I will post them here!

I've also done the DNAPrint 2.0 and 2.5. I am waiting for a kit to get my CODIS markers tested.

For those of you who don't know what these autosomal biparental markers are, they are the markers on all the rest of our chromosomes. These have bits of information inherited from all of our ancestors, both paternal and maternal.

They include:

CSF1PO
D3S1358
D5S818
D7S820
D8S1179
D13S317
D16S539
D18S51
D21S11
FGA (=FIBRA)
Penta D
Penta E
TH01
TPOX
vWA
D2S1338
D19S433
F13A01
F13B
FESFPS
LPL
Penta B
Penta C
SE33 (=ACTBP2)

The results are compared to a database of African, East Asian, Native American and European populations to help determine with which group one has the greatest affinity.

BTW, in case you were not aware, we are the featured DNA Project of the week for ISOGG!

Thank you all for participating.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GregKiroKH
Thanks for making it available, Ana. I think it is a nice article even thou it is from 1999. It is the same article. I had a copy on my key, and I read it this morning. I think I am excited about genetics again. Are there any newer articles to read concerning autosomes or human genetics?
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  #22  
Old 27th August 2006, 08:37 PM
clarkedenise clarkedenise is offline
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Autosomal Test Results

Dear Dra. Ana & Greg,
I also recently received my autosomal test results this month. I had the Ancestry By DNA 2.5. Here are my results: 56% Sub-Saharan African, 33% European, 11% East Asian, 0% Native American. East Asian was surprising, however; I'm told that Native Ancestry sometimes will show up as East Asian. Should I also consider doing a Codis test and what should I expect to learn from this test?
Denise
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  #23  
Old 28th August 2006, 12:38 AM
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casadecoqui casadecoqui is offline
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The best explanation for the CODIS markers is on the website by DNA Fingerprint which offers the test. They also have samples of the reports which they send to their clients. It is the the new company located in Germany which merged with FTDNA. A new state of the art facility is being built in Houston to provide all their specialty tests stateside and will have a "super duper DNA sequencer".

DNA Fingerprint

It is true that it is difficult to tell whether the frequency of specific AIMs [Allele Informative Markers] is due to Native American or East Asian ancestry. This is obviously so because they share ancient ancestral roots. Haplogroups A, B, C, D and Native American Haplogroup X are derived from those groups which migrated from around the Mongolian Lake Biakal area and crossed the Bering Strait to North America.

The Biogeographical test (BGA) is still, at best, imperfect since although it should pick up traces up to 5 generations back, it falls short of that.

For instance, I am admixed individual. (Duh) However, on the 2.0 test, I was 76% European and 24% East Asian and 0% NA, 0% SA. My maternal grandfather and grandmother are Native American Haplogroup C. I have others as well. There are no documented Asians in my lines literally as far back as the colonization. My ancestors have been on the island since before the Indians guided the lost Columbus to their land. That 24% is undoubtedly from my Taíno ancestry and not East Asian.

On the other hand, my maternal 4th great grandmother and about 10 other couples on both paternal and maternal side were slaves. So, the BGA as it is now obviously does not do well at providing AIMs which can significantly and accurately determine ancestry in admixed peoples ... or others for that matter unless they are overwhelmingly European.

The CODIS markers on the other hand are used forensically and are biparental, ie. one would be sure to pick up DNA obtained through recombination which has occurred generation after generation. This DNA information is inherited from the rest of your ancestors. It provides more ancestral data than if you just were to test the yDNA or solely the mtDNA from your 2 immediate ancestors, your parents. The information from the CODIS markers would help better define your probable ancient ancestral associations by comparing the results to a CODIS database.

Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkedenise
Dear Dra. Ana & Greg,
I also recently received my autosomal test results this month. I had the Ancestry By DNA 2.5. Here are my results: 56% Sub-Saharan African, 33% European, 11% East Asian, 0% Native American. East Asian was surprising, however; I'm told that Native Ancestry sometimes will show up as East Asian. Should I also consider doing a Codis test and what should I expect to learn from this test?
Denise
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  #24  
Old 28th August 2006, 03:40 PM
clarkedenise clarkedenise is offline
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Codis Tests

Thanks Dra. Ana,
I research further the Codis testing.
Denise
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  #25  
Old 28th August 2006, 08:55 PM
GregKiroKH GregKiroKH is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkedenise
Thanks Dra. Ana,
I research further the Codis testing.
Denise
I do not know why Asian DNA seems to replace Native American DNA for some people. I think it has to do with migration patterns.

The AncestryByDNA 2.5 test will not allow customers to investigate each marker. This is a little frustrating. Still, they did a good job finding European markers.

The Codis are well known. They have been used for years. So, one day, I would like to know my results because of the information available to the public.

I think the commercial market has limited scientific reasoning. Still, it is interesting. So, I still look for good articles too.
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  #26  
Old 28th August 2006, 09:40 PM
Sonia Sonia is offline
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Gram's ABD2.5 & CODIS

Greetings everyone!
Today I unpacked 15 of my 87 boxes at school Anyway, I've been thinking about Gram's CODIS results from DNAFP>DNA Tribes for about 3 weeks. Very curious stuff. Anyway, Gram is the least admixed of us Heinz 57 varieties in the family with her 2004 ABD 2.5 test indicating 82% Sub-Saharan African and 18% European. Her response then (at 99 you can say anything you want): "I don't care what any test says, I do have Indian in me and I don't have White in me." Anyway, she's been game for collecting her samples so we have them in the future and I thought we might get some interesting results from the CODIS Markers, but now I think that her admixture might still be too great to give us anything definitive. So, I'd keep this in mind if you're a well-admixed person. While the report gives her Top 20 Matches in each category, I'll just give the top 5. When you look at the numbers and compare them to those that people post on Charles Kercher's Log, you'll see what I mean about the results being far from informative, unless by Indian she means India Indian, but then again we've had that weird talk of SC Blackfoot (S: "They live in the Northern midwest & Canada, Gram." G: Wherever they are, my mother had Indian relatives in North Carolina." Over the past 10 years of online searching, I've discovered connections with 4 distant relatives, all who have heard the NC Indian connection (only Gram has the Blackfoot thing, but I've heard it from other South Carolinians). She also remembers being 3 or 4 when her mother died and an old Indian woman stayed with them. So, no DNA evidence, and she's the last of her line. Autosomal testing of nieces/nephews would throw in their other parents' DNA history.

Part B Native Pop. Match from "338 Native Pops that have experienced minimal movement and admixture in modern history" and Part C Global Pop. Match from "511 global pops, including native peoples as well as Diaspora groups that have expanded from their homelands and sometimes admixed with others in recent history" were both the same:
Upper Caste (Andhra Pradesh, India) - 49.8
Lower Middle Caste (Andhra Pradesh, India) - 38.4
Upper Middle Caste (Andhra Pradesh, India) - 37.2
Mongol (Ximeng, Inner Mongolia) - 17.1
Chueta (Spain) - 10.8
And it goes down from there. The only African match was #18 in Part B of El-Minia, Egypt at 2.6 which was #19 in Part C.

Part D World Region Matches "These regions are the product of long term patterns of interactions between peoples within major geographic and cultural zones over hundreds and often thousands of years." Really "weak" numbers:
Sub-Saharan African - 0.4
North African - 0.3
Arabian - 0.1
Tibetan - looks to be about 0.09
Asia Minor - looks to be about 0.06
Mestizo - about 0.05
and they go way down from there.

Any ideas?

My thoughts - contamination? too much admixture? lab error? My advice - absolutely preserve the DNA, take the tests, but realize that with small sample sizes in the databases we won't know a lot for awhile. My next step is to order a kit for Gram from a company that stores DNA. That way I know I'll have a sample to test against these results in the future. (No, I haven't heard back from the company when I queried about whether they'd seen any other really weak results or whether they thought contamination could be a possibility.)

I'm still working on understanding the Omnipop thingy, but the results do change significantly when I put both strands in and differ from when I put each strand in separately.

Sonia
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  #27  
Old 4th September 2006, 08:15 PM
GregKiroKH GregKiroKH is offline
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History of One Drop Rule, Autosomes

Quote:
Until the advent of the one-drop rule of invisible Blackness in the 1830s, courts relied on a combination of three rules to determine whether someone was Black or White. The first was the rule of physical appearance. The second was the rule of blood fraction. The third was the rule of association.
Since 1265, Spanish law had upheld the doctrine that the burden of proof always lay upon the party arguing that someone was a slave. Spanish King Alfonso X had decreed that, since slavery was odious and contrary to Church teachings, it had to be supported by positive evidence.
The earliest blood fraction law in British North America was that of 1705 Virginia, which defined "Black" as anyone with one or more "Negro" great-grandparents (1/8 or more Negro blood made you Black). This was amended in 1785 Virginia to be anyone with one or more "Negro" grandparents (1/4 or more Negro blood made you Black).
Finally, Americans of about 15 percent African admixture or less are usually accepted as members of the White endogamous group. And those of roughly 35 percent African admixture or more are usually relegated to the Black side of the U.S. color line.
http://backintyme.com/essay040811.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancestr...rmative_marker
In order to understand my autosomal results better, I have been looking at some articles. I do not know if they are too difficult for general reading. Still, I listed the links as well as a quote.
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  #28  
Old 13th October 2006, 11:57 PM
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casadecoqui casadecoqui is offline
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For those of you who have tested at particular companies touting their ability to match you to specific tribe in Africa, please read this:

From the Scientific American:

Those hoping to trace their ancestry to a particular African tribe are unlikely to find a perfect match, according to a new genetic study. Researchers report that mitochondrial DNA isolated from African-Americans matched up to distinct African ethnic groups in fewer than 10 percent of cases, based on a partial database of African DNA samples. Broader or more probabilistic ancestries are still possible, however.
An individual's genes are a link to the past that stretches across any break in family name or birthplace through the generations. But not all genes are equally useful in tracing ancestries. The genes present on chromosomes are mixed extensively in every generation, making them a crude guide. In contrast, mitochondrial DNA is passed down from mother to child relatively unchanged, offering an individual the chance of identifying a distinct modern population, such as an ethnic group, having the same ancestors. Such reconstructions may still be imprecise, however, because mitochondrial sequences originating in one ethnic group can easily leak to others as women migrate.

Read the rest of the article here: Scientific American
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  #29  
Old 14th October 2006, 12:01 PM
clarkedenise clarkedenise is offline
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Smile Codis Test

Dra. Ana,
I've noticed that FTDNA now offers the Autosomal DNA. In reading the description of the test, it appears to be different than the DNA 2.5 test that I have already completed. Is that correct. Is this test is similar to the DNATribe test?

Also, I emailed FTDNA for further clarification regarding my Father SNP test. His Haplogroup Group remained E. I asked FTDNA if my Dad was genotyped at M35 or P2 and if so was the result 'derived' or 'ancestral'. I'll let everyone know what the response was. I should have his Y-25/37 marker results mid November 06.

Thank-you
Denise
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  #30  
Old 14th October 2006, 10:02 PM
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casadecoqui casadecoqui is offline
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Yes that is correct. the DNA Print gives you the perntage of each of the major ethnic groups: IE, SA, NA, and EA that may show up from the last 5 generations.

With the autosomal markers you can compare your actual results to a database of different populations to determine to which you most closely have an affinity. There are other posts in the forum from members who have had autosomal and/or Codis testing that will answer many of your questions.

It will be interesting to find out what they say about your father's results. Keep us posted. He is only 1 of 3 SNP'd Haplogroup E haplotypes in our project.

Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkedenise
Dra. Ana,
I've noticed that FTDNA now offers the Autosomal DNA. In reading the description of the test, it appears to be different than the DNA 2.5 test that I have already completed. Is that correct. Is this test is similar to the DNATribe test?

Also, I emailed FTDNA for further clarification regarding my Father SNP test. His Haplogroup Group remained E. I asked FTDNA if my Dad was genotyped at M35 or P2 and if so was the result 'derived' or 'ancestral'. I'll let everyone know what the response was. I should have his Y-25/37 marker results mid November 06.

Thank-you
Denise
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