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Old 14th July 2017, 01:28 PM
Cartier2028 Cartier2028 is offline
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Posts: 1
Italian vs Iberian DNA in Results

Hi everyone,

I am curious if anyone else has run into very different ancestry results utilizing different services when it comes to identifying Italian vs Iberian ancestry. In my case, we know that my maternal grandmother was Puerto Rican, but we are trying to identify whether my maternal grandfather was one of two individuals, one who was Puerto Rican, and the other who was Sicilian (both deceased).

Unfortunately, the differing results between tests have not helped us to resolve this problem. My results through different testing services and analyses have been:

23 and Me
47.1% Ashkenazi Jewish
25% Iberian
0.7% Italian
10.2% Broadly Southern European

5.4% Native American
4% Sub Saharan African
7.6% Misc/Unk

Ancestry
48% Ashkenazi Jewish
11% Iberian
15% Italy/Greece

6% Native American
7% Africa
13% Misc/Unk

FTDNA
49% Ashkenazi Jewish
18% Italy/Greece
13% Iberia

6% British Isles
6% Native American
6% African
2% Misc/Unk

DNA Land
51% Ashkenazi Jewish
Southwest European/Iberian 27%
Italian 0%

African 13%
Native American 6.3%
2.7% Misc/Unk

Obviously with both populations being Mediterranean and there having been some degree of interchange between the two (Italians in Iberia during the Roman period and Iberians in Southern Italy/Sicily via the Aragonese, etc) there would be some degree of genetic confusion between them. But for the degree of Italian to range from nothing to 1/5th between tests seems unusual. Has anyone else encountered this?
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Old 14th July 2017, 01:45 PM
EMC EMC is online now
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Posts: 26
I don't have an explanation, but the same happens to me. I'm 11/16 Italian and 5/16 Portuguese, but FTDNA gives me 56% Iberia, 37% Southeast Europe (Italy/Greece) and 5% West and Central Europe.

At MyHeritage, even my grandmother, whose 4 grandparents were born in Italy, has more Iberian than Italian (41% vs 15.2%). I want to see her results at FTDNA too, but the site isn't accepting uploads from MyHeritage at the moment...
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Old 14th July 2017, 02:23 PM
khazaria khazaria is offline
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Posts: 399
Cartier2028 should search for any DNA cousin matches who appear to be full Sicilians.

Note that Sicilians have significant Middle Eastern DNA signals, but Cartier2028 omitted Middle Eastern scores from the accounting. However, Puerto Ricans and Ashkenazic Jews also can score residual Middle Eastern scores, so even such scores can have multiple explanations.
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Old 14th July 2017, 02:33 PM
EMC EMC is online now
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Khazaria, do you know if it's usual for people from North Italy to have Middle Eastern scores too? I'm asking because people in my family are showing unexplained (albeit small) Ashkenazi % at MyHeritage.

Quote:
Originally Posted by khazaria View Post
Cartier2028 should search for any DNA cousin matches who appear to be full Sicilians.

Note that Sicilians have significant Middle Eastern DNA signals, but Cartier2028 omitted Middle Eastern scores from the accounting. However, Puerto Ricans and Ashkenazic Jews also can score residual Middle Eastern scores, so even such scores can have multiple explanations.
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  #5  
Old 14th July 2017, 02:36 PM
khazaria khazaria is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMC View Post
Khazaria, do you know if it's usual for people from North Italy to have Middle Eastern scores too? I'm asking because people in my family are showing unexplained (albeit small) Ashkenazi % at MyHeritage.
That's a different situation. Ashkenazim have partial ancestry from northern Italy from 1000+ years ago, so there is an underlying similarity there. Also, some Ashkenazim moved back to Italy centuries after that.

By Middle Eastern signals appearing in admixture estimates, I meant non-Ashkenazic categories like "West Asia", "North Africa", "Asia Minor", "Middle Eastern".
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Old 14th July 2017, 02:42 PM
EMC EMC is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khazaria View Post
That's a different situation. Ashkenazim have partial ancestry from northern Italy from 1000+ years ago, so there is an underlying similarity there. Also, some Ashkenazim moved back to Italy centuries after that.

By Middle Eastern signals appearing in admixture estimates, I meant non-Ashkenazic categories like "West Asia", "North Africa", "Asia Minor", "Middle Eastern".
Thanks. I think MyHeritage inflates or even makes up Jewish ancestry. When I got my results I had 7.6 AJ and 1.5% ME and the only explanation I found was my grandfather's family, that was of rumoured marrano origin. But then I tested my grandmother and she got 4.6% AJ, but all of her grandparents were from North Italy.
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Old 14th July 2017, 04:31 PM
vinnie vinnie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartier2028 View Post
Hi everyone,
I am curious if anyone else has run into very different ancestry results utilizing different services when it comes to identifying Italian vs Iberian ancestry. In my case, we know that my maternal grandmother was Puerto Rican, but we are trying to identify whether my maternal grandfather was one of two individuals, one who was Puerto Rican, and the other who was Sicilian (both deceased).
Comparing ethnicity results will not give you the answer that you're looking for. If you're able to, you must test at least two persons (one for each possible gf) who could be closest to both you and the possible gf. Depending on how distant the actual genealogical relationship is between you and each person, the amount of shared autosomal DNA between you and each of them will give you a much better idea as to which of the two men (if either of them) was your grandfather.
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  #8  
Old 14th July 2017, 06:47 PM
Frank Kelch Frank Kelch is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cartier2028 View Post
Hi everyone,

I am curious if anyone else has run into very different ancestry results utilizing different services when it comes to identifying Italian vs Iberian ancestry. In my case, we know that my maternal grandmother was Puerto Rican, but we are trying to identify whether my maternal grandfather was one of two individuals, one who was Puerto Rican, and the other who was Sicilian (both deceased).

Unfortunately, the differing results between tests have not helped us to resolve this problem. My results through different testing services and analyses have been:

23 and Me
47.1% Ashkenazi Jewish
25% Iberian
0.7% Italian
10.2% Broadly Southern European

5.4% Native American
4% Sub Saharan African
7.6% Misc/Unk

Ancestry
48% Ashkenazi Jewish
11% Iberian
15% Italy/Greece

6% Native American
7% Africa
13% Misc/Unk

FTDNA
49% Ashkenazi Jewish
18% Italy/Greece
13% Iberia

6% British Isles
6% Native American
6% African
2% Misc/Unk

DNA Land
51% Ashkenazi Jewish
Southwest European/Iberian 27%
Italian 0%

African 13%
Native American 6.3%
2.7% Misc/Unk

Obviously with both populations being Mediterranean and there having been some degree of interchange between the two (Italians in Iberia during the Roman period and Iberians in Southern Italy/Sicily via the Aragonese, etc) there would be some degree of genetic confusion between them. But for the degree of Italian to range from nothing to 1/5th between tests seems unusual. Has anyone else encountered this?

Go through your Family Finder matches and see whether there's a large number of Italians or Puerto Ricans. That should give you your answer, probably won't take more than ten minutes.
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  #9  
Old 14th July 2017, 07:02 PM
JerryS. JerryS. is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 82
they say "MyHeritage" gives everyone no matter their race/ethnicity at least some jewish DNA markers. I'm awaiting my results.
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  #10  
Old 14th July 2017, 09:30 PM
NCroots NCroots is online now
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Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 183
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryS. View Post
they say "MyHeritage" gives everyone no matter their race/ethnicity at least some jewish DNA markers. I'm awaiting my results.
Not me... MyHeritage gave me North African

And gave my son 6.4% Italian.
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