Go Back   Family Tree DNA Forums > Family Tree DNA Communications > Grumbles & Gripes

Grumbles & Gripes This is a place for free and open grumbling, griping, and venting about anything and everything about DNA, companies, and genealogy that irks you. You may even come here to complain about the Forums and how they are run.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 9th January 2018, 03:52 PM
Miamio Miamio is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 95
Blog Entries: 1
Ashkenazie/Sefardic dilemna

I tested with autosomal here last and transferred data to Ged Match and My Heritage.I have documented info that goes back to my third gt gmother.There are literally hundreds of matches.
.All my results have me as high 90s percentile Ashkenazie which I expected.The other,Mid Eastern,North Africa etc.There is a Sefardic myth about my maternal gt gf.from Italy and the ethnicity shows that area is Southern Europe.He,however spoke Yiddish and documents state He was born in Russia.My paternal line changed names and info all the time. Ged Match is confusing me as to the ethnicities.I understand Jewish Diaspora and history encompassed a lot of places.All four grandparents spoke Yiddish.Not anything mid eastern or Sefardic.None of the names of the many matches appear Sefardic,except for a few in the heat map of My Origins.I have read and reread these sites and it is so complicated.No males to test.Ged Match has made me depressed as it is hard to decipher.My paternal family are very secretive. How do I finally come to a conclusion between these sites as to this ethnicity? Is there someone I can pay to sort it all out? Russia and Poland do nott exist except on the My Origins Diaspora map. There is no other ethnicity outside of Jewish.Can anyone help me? How many generations does all of ths even go back?

Last edited by Miamio; 9th January 2018 at 03:55 PM. Reason: O
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 3rd February 2018, 02:49 AM
Aniara Aniara is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 132
I think generally autosomal tests are considered accurate up to 4 or 5 generations. I, however, personally think they're useful much further back, but it's not a widely held belief.

I don't think any of the testing companies will be able to give you the answer you need because ethnicity estimates are not perfect at any of them.

I do suggest joining the One World One Tree project at Living DNA. It may never give you the answer you need, but it couldn't hurt, and maybe it will help. Results of that project will take at least 6 months, likely more than a year considering what they're trying to accomplish.

https://www.livingdna.com/en-us/one-family/research

My husband and I went ahead and tested with them because some of their SNPs are different from FTDNA's, but I manage 3 other kits (probably 2 to 3 more soon) and I'll be uploading them.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10th February 2018, 06:17 PM
Miamio Miamio is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 95
Blog Entries: 1
Ashkenazi/Sephardic Dilemna

I did upload to Living Dna,before learning it takes six months and is more geared to the UK. I know my Ashkenazi roots back 3-4 generations.All the sites have given me anywhere from 3-12% Sephardic somewhere.Ged Match also.I had triangulation done.,Mexican,Filipino,Colombian etc......now how in hell could I ever find common ground? Itís hard to imagine Ashkenazis(Fiddler on the roof) intermarrying,raping,kidnapping women in other cultures or countries.So this must be ancient when Jews were just tribes.There is a family myth which led me to this search,but so far would be my very Polish Gt Gf,unless all his info was a lie.It was hidden.Secrets,multiple aliases,etc,very common......Itís making me sad.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10th February 2018, 06:39 PM
josh w. josh w. is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miamio View Post
I did upload to Living Dna,before learning it takes six months and is more geared to the UK. I know my Ashkenazi roots back 3-4 generations.All the sites have given me anywhere from 3-12% Sephardic somewhere.Ged Match also.I had triangulation done.,Mexican,Filipino,Colombian etc......now how in hell could I ever find common ground? It’s hard to imagine Ashkenazis(Fiddler on the roof) intermarrying,raping,kidnapping women in other cultures or countries.So this must be ancient when Jews were just tribes.There is a family myth which led me to this search,but so far would be my very Polish Gt Gf,unless all his info was a lie.It was hidden.Secrets,multiple aliases,etc,very common......It’s making me sad.
Sephardic Jews lived around 800-1500 AD. All of them fled Iberia or converted. Some went to eastern Europe, North Africa and the New World. I have Mexican matches with convesos, but I don't know how I am related. FF usually only goes back to around 5-6 cousins most of the time. Many Ashkenazi don't realize that they might have Sephardic ancestors.

There is no mystery. Sephardic Jews fled Iberia to other areas. My Mexican matches were from Iberia--they were cousins of my ancestors who fled to Poland and Lithuania.

Last edited by josh w.; 10th February 2018 at 06:49 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11th February 2018, 07:20 PM
Miamio Miamio is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 95
Blog Entries: 1
Ashkenazi dilemna

But donít you want to know if your roots are Spain,Greece,Sicily? I sure do.
I also want to know more......I know all about the migrations and diaspora.I lived in the Mid East and travelled .
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11th February 2018, 09:23 PM
josh w. josh w. is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miamio View Post
But don’t you want to know if your roots are Spain,Greece,Sicily? I sure do.
I also want to know more......I know all about the migrations and diaspora.I lived in the Mid East and travelled .
All Sephardim began in Spain. Jews have been in Spain since Roman times. I would like to know more but there appear to be at least two main routes. I have a match who can trace his family to the Netherlands and then points east. A second route is via Sicily, the Italian mainland, Greece and Turkey. My hunch is that the first route was more likely to land in Eastern Europe.
.
Note that there were two Sephardic subgroups, those that remained Jewish and those that converted. Of the conversos, some went back to Judaism but others remained Catholic. My Mexican and Central American matches are Catholic and reluctant to discuss their Jewish history.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11th February 2018, 09:27 PM
josh w. josh w. is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,536
Quote:
Originally Posted by josh w. View Post
All Sephardim began in Spain. Jews have been in Spain since Roman times. I would like to know more but there appear to be at least two main routes. I have a match who can trace his family to the Netherlands and then points east. A second route is via Sicily, the Italian mainland, Greece and Turkey. My hunch is that the first route was more likely to land in Eastern Europe. By the way at FTDNA there is a Jewish and Italian My Origins Project as well as Sephardic groups
.
Note that there were two Sephardic subgroups, those that remained Jewish and those that converted. Of the conversos, some went back to Judaism but others remained Catholic. My Mexican and Central American matches are Catholic and reluctant to discuss their Jewish history.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12th February 2018, 07:43 AM
Miamio Miamio is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 95
Blog Entries: 1
Ashkenazi/ Sephardic

So we will never know then.Some people are as interested as we are.Others are downright unfriendly or uninterested.I am feeling more and more that all of this searching,for many,is seen as an invasion of privacy.
Others wonít take the time to upload and research.All they see is if you do not thatís the same surname,there is no match.I was also given the maes of Mexicans,Colombians etc with DNA matches....One responded but doesnít understand it all.I blame the TV commercials that glamorize and glorify this.The shows that simplify it.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12th February 2018, 09:22 AM
josh w. josh w. is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miamio View Post
So we will never know then.Some people are as interested as we are.Others are downright unfriendly or uninterested.I am feeling more and more that all of this searching,for many,is seen as an invasion of privacy.
Others wonít take the time to upload and research.All they see is if you do not thatís the same surname,there is no match.I was also given the maes of Mexicans,Colombians etc with DNA matches....One responded but doesnít understand it all.I blame the TV commercials that glamorize and glorify this.The shows that simplify it.
Yes, patience is needed in searches, but some will never respond. There is even a thesis at the Hebrew University about the difficulty of getting the families of my Mexican matches to respond---but they finally opened up.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 15th February 2018, 12:23 PM
Miamio Miamio is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 95
Blog Entries: 1
After reading some more about Jews in Sicily and Italy with Ashkenazi admixtures,I am going with GedMatch Oracles.Used all the world calculations they have for this population.It all points out to Italy,which corresponds with the family myth. My one Gt Gf was indeed in Milan as a jeweler to a pope and his Icons. It was a secret ,I do not know.I would like to find out about his parents.He claims to have been born in Russia.The
Allieses he used weíre amazing.My other gf also did the same thing.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:44 PM.


Family Tree DNA - World Headquarters

1445 North Loop West, Suite 820
Houston, Texas 77008, USA

Phone: (713) 868-1438 | Fax: (832) 201-7147
Copyright 2001-2010 Genealogy by Genetics, Ltd.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.