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  #21  
Old 20th February 2018, 12:54 PM
Miamio Miamio is offline
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I canít figure out why people do certain things. I do know my Ashkenazi people are stubborn and often obnoxious.They make you feel like an intruder.So why bother doing a public tree and email info? I want to shout from the mountain tops that Common surnames alone do not verify a match to,you.
If you canít find anyone past who you have on your tree,why shut the door in my face?Lets find our common ancestor.
One nice guy told me his kit and password number.Asked me to to do all the work and let him know.Wait...at least he responded! He doesnít want to learn the browser and use the tools.It is confusing,but then why post your info and tree? The ones I have found with the surname and same place,
etc,just did not get it.
I have a suggestion: have the ethnic and matches totally separate entities.
Put the family tree separately.Something has to change.
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  #22  
Old 20th February 2018, 02:32 PM
ltd-jean-pull ltd-jean-pull is offline
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You just have to get used to it Miamio.

I've been very disappointed in the response from relatives from one branch of the family. When my gtgt-grandmother stated she was a spinster when she married my gtgt-grandfather I assumed she was a spinster. She'd been a brick wall. Her granddaughter thought she may have been Danish. Her death certificate said she was Scottish.

With the benefit of hindsight I know she intentionally used an alternative spelling of her surname when she married, and this same spelling was used on her death certificate. Her son made a mistake with his maternal grandmother's surname on the death certificate.

I ordered as many records of her as I could - they seemed very consistent wrt her age, and when her husband registered the births of her younger children he said she was from Edinburgh. So that put the Danish myth to rest. But I still didn't know who her family were, or where her family lived at this time.

Through a messageboard an experienced local genealogist offered to have a look for me. It was a win-win as I live near a cemetery that she wanted records from. Within an hour or two she found a likely family, and they were one I had identified as a possibility on a shipping record (with the incorrect spelling!)

The genealogist was an Ancestry member so she made contact with a couple of people who had my gtgt-grandmother on her tree. They were very doubtful of this connection because their records showed she'd married someone else. That didn't sound right to me. Their records had her remarrying a few years later and moving several hundred miles away.

But infact, it WAS true. She had been married before. The marriage took place at the family home, but they've lied about her age. She was a minor, but they've bumped her age up. I have no idea why, because her father is one of the witnesses and he could easily have given permission for her to marry.

I spoke on the phone to one of these "cousins". I even suggested that we might be able to solve this with DNA, but she said she didn't think it was necessary. The way it was said implied she didn't believe we were related.

This mystery continued to bug me. I investigated the person they thought was their missing gt-aunt (the one who'd remarried and moved hundreds of miles away). I found her will and she was Australian, and all the people mentioned in her will were her Australian nieces and nephews. The cemetery record also said she was Australian. I passed this information on to the "cousins". No response.

Then I looked more closely at my gt-grandparent's marriage certificate and realised that one of the witnesses was the husband of one of the sisters we're supposedly not related to. Without saying why I asked one of the cousins what the address was of this uncle, and she replied with his address from the electoral roll. The name, address and occupation of the witness matches the details she gave me. By this time they included the names of the parents of the bride and groom and this is the ONLY record which has the name spelled correctly, and that may be because the uncle knew his wife's correct surname. I passed this information on to the "cousins". I sent them the marriage certificate. No response from one of them and the other replied with "WE ARE NOT RELATED. I DON'T KNOW WHY HE WAS AT THEIR WEDDING". To be frank, I've wondered whether she is getting dementia, and I haven't corresponded with her since.

I bided my time hoping that a DNA match would appear. A few months ago one appeared at MyHeritage. Her tree doesn't go back as far as Scotland, but I know the lineage. She's descended from a sister of our gtgt-grandmother. I passed this information on to the other "cousin" - the one who didn't think DNA was necessary. No response.

Last year one of my siblings was given an Ancestry DNA test. After having his results for a few weeks and not logging in he decided it might be simpler to let me manage it for him. Guess who was on the first page of matches? The "cousin" who didn't think a DNA test was necessary (descended from the same sister as the MyHeritage match), and a descendant of another sister.

I haven't heard from either of them. I know the woman who didn't think a DNA test was necessary has some family photos. I've asked whether it might be possible to have copies (digital would be fine) but I've had no response. She logs in to Ancestry regularly.

I'm completely puzzled by this.

There's also matches with descendants of the gtgt-grandmother's maternal aunts and uncles. They're scattered all around the globe and they've actually been quite communicative!

Last edited by ltd-jean-pull; 20th February 2018 at 02:39 PM.
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  #23  
Old 23rd February 2018, 09:46 PM
Miamio Miamio is offline
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You certainly are dedicated.I have name changes and family secrets also.Seems back then,doing so was quite easy.My own families are estranged.I, ew everyone when I was growing up,Have documentation etc....I donít want to know anymore cousins...I gave up.Unless the other person is cooperative and as interested,it doesnít work.I will never see a
Potential cousin who lives in Argentina...and all I want is to continue my Sephardic search.My family were secretive and had a lot to hide,evidently.
I have thousands of matches.Now I have tried for the Sephardic ones to solve the mystery.Its almost impossible.Who would even want to know the family secrets? Only me.I am the first grandchild on all sides.There are now two more generations that donít care about each other and never knew the grandparents,greats etc that I knew. Very sad.....
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  #24  
Old 23rd February 2018, 10:18 PM
Carpathian Carpathian is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miamio View Post
You certainly are dedicated.I have name changes and family secrets also.Seems back then,doing so was quite easy.My own families are estranged.I, ew everyone when I was growing up,Have documentation etc....I donít want to know anymore cousins...I gave up.Unless the other person is cooperative and as interested,it doesnít work.I will never see a
Potential cousin who lives in Argentina...and all I want is to continue my Sephardic search.My family were secretive and had a lot to hide,evidently.
I have thousands of matches.Now I have tried for the Sephardic ones to solve the mystery.Its almost impossible.Who would even want to know the family secrets? Only me.I am the first grandchild on all sides.There are now two more generations that donít care about each other and never knew the grandparents,greats etc that I knew. Very sad.....
Denial is more than a river in Egypt. It exists in virtually every family. Finding and knowing family "secrets" of prior generations leads to understanding them and not repeating those mistakes or shortcomings in the future.

"You just have to get used to it Miamio."

Denial is more than a river in Egypt. It exists in virtually every family. Get used to it.

You can't change your ancestry. You can't change your living relatives or how they act. Some or all of them are still in the river of denial.

But change can begin with YOU. Once you change yourself by rejecting past and present generations of denial, you can change the course of your life and that of future generations. If you will to do it, you will do it.
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  #25  
Old 24th February 2018, 12:10 AM
ltd-jean-pull ltd-jean-pull is offline
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I'm not hoping for a family reunion or anything. All I was hoping for was copies of any of the old photos of our MUTUAL ancestors. We don't have any photos of my gtgt-grandmother, but there I know they have photos of a couple of her sisters and also of her mother.

And I'd hope they'd correct their trees (which are now private). The two people I was in contact with are considered to be the genealogy experts in the family. I suspect they're embarrassed to have got it wrong.

Clearly my gtgt-grandmother was disowned by her strict Presbyterian family. Her misdeeds were numerous (and often reported in the papers) and I don't know how she escaped being charged with perjury.

I find it amusing that more than a century later her siblings' descendants are just as stuffy.

I manage the grave of her parents at Findagrave. I contacted the manager (who has since "retired" from Findagrave so the other graves she managed are in limbo) and requested a transfer. Probably someone will contact me in the future and ask why I manage the grave of "their" ancestor and I'll be happy to explain the connection. I might even connect this grave to my gtgt-grandmother's grave. She has no headstone and I suspect it's a pauper's plot.

Last edited by ltd-jean-pull; 24th February 2018 at 12:17 AM.
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  #26  
Old 24th February 2018, 10:22 AM
Miamio Miamio is offline
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Nothing to forgive,forget or accept here. It is what itís is.Just venting frustration with the whole DNA/ancestory explosion. No need for condescending remarks either.This is a forum to express and share.
We learn from each other.I have learned a lot from others trials and tribulations. What info and documentation that I do have will be passed on down thru my own children.Their ancestors stories will not be in vain.Their pictures wonít be sold at an antique flea market,to adorn someoneís coffee table.
Generations ago,people got away with a lot of things.It was easy to disguise oneself as someone else. There is nothing to learn/ repeat.
Immigrants wanted to escape and assimilate at any cost.
This is a different world. Yes I am frustrated at the lack of definitive
results and I do not expect any of my family to change.

Last edited by Miamio; 24th February 2018 at 10:23 AM. Reason: Typos
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  #27  
Old 24th February 2018, 10:33 PM
Carpathian Carpathian is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miamio View Post
Nothing to forgive,forget or accept here. It is what it’s is.Just venting frustration with the whole DNA/ancestory explosion.
Ultimately, all of life is about acceptance, as is genealogy - of who we are and where we came from.

Quote:
No need for condescending remarks either.
"You just have to get used to it Miamio."

Is that what you took to be condescending? I didn't say that. But I quoted it, because it applies to everyone - you, me and everyone, universally. Try not to take it personally.

Quote:
Generations ago,people got away with a lot of things.It was easy to disguise oneself as someone else. There is nothing to learn/ repeat.
Immigrants wanted to escape and assimilate at any cost.
This is a different world. Yes I am frustrated at the lack of definitive
results and I do not expect any of my family to change.
People today still get away with a lot of things. It is now easier than ever to disguise oneself as someone else. Immigrants still want to escape and assimilate at any cost. (But now many immigrants don't want to assimilate.)

So, no. This really is not an entirely different world now. Human nature remains constant and life is a continuum. "The fundamental things apply, as time goes by..."
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  #28  
Old 25th February 2018, 01:05 PM
clintonslayton76 clintonslayton76 is offline
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Expectations are skewed on these forums

The term genetic genealogy is a convenient term, but it is a portmanteau term that is a misnomer based on hubris: Genetics is a theoretical branch of science and genealogy is a narrative-based form of history. Anyone can create false documents, change a name, or live and die with a name resulting from a clerical error.

DNA is not even a solid form of personal identification for relationships, it exists in the realm of probabilities.

The unrealistic expectations of finding "answers" for genealogical problems with genetics is the single most consistent complaint in these forums, whereas it should be, why are terminal SNP assignments not explained? Are mistakes being made in such determinations? Is FTDNA scientifically accurate?

Finding "answers" might in fact infringe on someone else's privacy, and FTDNA is not responsible for the levels of information provided (or not) by the participants. I try to focus on the things that I can reasonably expect from such a service, and point out those problems, not problems with what is and is not obvious from results that are not within FTDNA's or my control.
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