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  #1  
Old 10th January 2018, 07:44 AM
Malo Malo is offline
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Which Gedmatch Admixture do you use to find Sephardic roots?

Which Gedmatch Admixture should you use?

In trying to research potential Sephardic roots I used the Gedmatch Dodecad Africa 9 (Oracle 4) on the basis that my gggmother lived in Algeciras and worked in Gibraltar so a North African biased admixture would be a good fit.
Is that a reasonable assumption? Are the generations quite recent?

Results were:

Using 2 populations approximation:
1 50% French_Basque +50% North_African_Jews_Dodecad @ 4.768189


Using 3 populations approximation:
1 50% French_Basque +25% Libya +25% Tuscan @ 4.336068


Using 4 populations approximation:
+++++++++++++++
1 Egypt + French_Basque + French_Basque + Morocco_Jews @ 3.719753
2 French_Basque + French_Basque + Libya + Tuscan @ 4.336068
3 Egyptans + French_Basque + French_Basque + Morocco_Jews @ 4.476022
4 French_Basque + French_Basque + North_African_Jews_Dodecad + North_African_Jews_Dodecad @ 4.768189
5 French_Basque + French_Basque + Libya + Morocco_Jews @ 4.857472
6 French_Basque + Libya + North_Italian + North_Italian @ 4.874359
7 Egypt + French_Basque + French_Basque + North_African_Jews_Dodecad @ 5.005029
8 French_Basque + French_Basque + Morocco_Jews + North_African_Jews_Dodecad @ 5.078383
9 Druze + French_Basque + French_Basque + North_African_Dodecad @ 5.131461
10 French_Basque + North_African_Dodecad + North_Italian + Tuscan @ 5.227665
11 French_Basque + Morocco_Jews + Morocco_Jews + North_Italian @ 5.417712
12 French_Basque + North_African_Dodecad + North_Italian + North_Italian @ 5.470325
13 French_Basque + French_Basque + Libya + North_African_Jews_Dodecad @ 5.504620
14 French_Basque + North_African_Dodecad + Tuscan + Tuscan @ 5.515823
15 French_Basque + French_Basque + Jordanians + Morocco_Jews @ 5.548583
16 French_Basque + French_Basque + Libya + North_Italian @ 5.749614
17 Egyptans + French_Basque + French_Basque + North_African_Jews_Dodecad @ 5.801985
18 Egypt + French_Basque + North_Italian + North_Italian @ 5.910541
19 French_Basque + French_Basque + Morocco_Jews + Morocco_Jews @ 6.048207
20 French_Basque + Libya + North_Italian + Tuscan @ 6.124488
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  #2  
Old 11th January 2018, 04:59 PM
RebeccaR RebeccaR is offline
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I don't know which one specifically to use. I just personally click around until I find the closest distance

From main screen, click on

- Admixture/Oracle with Population Search
then simply key in
- Jew
and hit enter

It will list about 50 different Jewish populations and which project to test your DNA kit to see them.

See which one you come closest to in distance.

There is also a spreadsheet with different populations but not all the Jewish populations are listed.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...82Hcf/pubhtml#
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  #3  
Old 11th January 2018, 06:46 PM
khazaria khazaria is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malo View Post
Which Gedmatch Admixture do you use to find Sephardic roots?
None can tell you this reliably.
Instead, you should look for any Sephardic matches!
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  #4  
Old 11th January 2018, 07:43 PM
josh w. josh w. is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khazaria View Post
None can tell you this reliably.
Instead, you should look for any Sephardic matches!
Agree with Khazaria. FF's My Origins has a Sephardic reference group but it is of questionable value. North African Jews may serve as a proxy for Sephardics. What does Gedmatch Eurogenes show.
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  #5  
Old 12th January 2018, 05:53 PM
avujep avujep is offline
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Exclamation I don't know if I can believe it.

I have a 2017 myOrigins Chart which shows me as 76% British, 11% East Europe and 10% Sephardic with trace results for SE Europe and West Africa. This was a change from my 2016 myOrigins chart which has me at 94% European and 5% elsewhere in the Middle East and Africa.

I can find no precedent relative going back to my 4th great grandparents who were Jewish in any way. And, descendants of those relatives of mine who have been autosome tested have all been shown to be non-Sephardic or Jewish in any way.

FTDNA can not seem to give an answer to why the change. It simply says, that's the way it is from our calculations. If FTDNA has the ability to distinguish at the 10% level, it should I believe, be able to set up a comparison site where people who test as Jewish can immediately see who their matches are in this group and where in the chromosomes these matches are occurring.
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  #6  
Old 12th January 2018, 07:47 PM
josh w. josh w. is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by avujep View Post
I have a 2017 myOrigins Chart which shows me as 76% British, 11% East Europe and 10% Sephardic with trace results for SE Europe and West Africa. This was a change from my 2016 myOrigins chart which has me at 94% European and 5% elsewhere in the Middle East and Africa.

I can find no precedent relative going back to my 4th great grandparents who were Jewish in any way. And, descendants of those relatives of mine who have been autosome tested have all been shown to be non-Sephardic or Jewish in any way.

FTDNA can not seem to give an answer to why the change. It simply says, that's the way it is from our calculations. If FTDNA has the ability to distinguish at the 10% level, it should I believe, be able to set up a comparison site where people who test as Jewish can immediately see who their matches are in this group and where in the chromosomes these matches are occurring.
Do you have any Jewish matches. MO 2 Sephardic is of questionable validity at the 10% level. It is possible that Sephardic might be more valid at higher % levels (this appears to be the case with Ashkenazi levels) However, I am not aware of many individuals with higher Sephardic percentages.
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  #7  
Old 13th January 2018, 04:32 AM
Malo Malo is offline
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Which Gedmatch Admixture do you use to find Sephardic roots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by josh w. View Post
Agree with Khazaria. FF's My Origins has a Sephardic reference group but it is of questionable value. North African Jews may serve as a proxy for Sephardics. What does Gedmatch Eurogenes show.
Eurogenes J Test shows no Ashkenazi as I would have expected.

# Population Percent
1 ATLANTIC 27.98
2 NORTH-CENTRAL_EURO 27.81
3 WEST_MED 13.45
4 SOUTH_BALTIC 11.61
5 EAST_EURO 9.75
6 EAST_MED 8.27
7 WEST_ASIAN 1.07
8 SOUTH_ASIAN 0.06


# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 81.6% West_&_Central_German + 18.4% French_Basque @ 5.26
2 78.9% English + 21.1% ES @ 5.29
3 65.2% English + 34.8% FR @ 5.4
4 79.5% English + 20.5% PT @ 5.44
5 83.9% NL + 16.1% French_Basque @ 5.51
6 83.8% English + 16.2% North_Italian @ 5.54
7 94.5% Cornish + 5.5% Druze @ 5.54
8 88% Cornish + 12% Tuscan @ 5.61
9 78.8% NL + 21.2% ES @ 5.62
10 86.9% English + 13.1% Tuscan @ 5.63
11 51.7% FR + 48.3% DK @ 5.65
12 86.4% English + 13.6% French_Basque @ 5.67
13 66.5% DK + 33.5% ES @ 5.71
14 64.5% NL + 35.5% FR @ 5.72
15 70.8% Cornish + 29.2% FR @ 5.75
16 93.7% English + 6.3% Sardinian @ 5.75
17 83.9% Cornish + 16.1% PT @ 5.77
18 87.1% Cornish + 12.9% North_Italian @ 5.78
19 94.6% English + 5.4% Druze @ 5.79
20 95.3% Cornish + 4.7% Samaritan @ 5.81
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  #8  
Old 13th January 2018, 11:58 AM
josh w. josh w. is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malo View Post
Eurogenes J Test shows no Ashkenazi as I would have expected.

# Population Percent
1 ATLANTIC 27.98
2 NORTH-CENTRAL_EURO 27.81
3 WEST_MED 13.45
4 SOUTH_BALTIC 11.61
5 EAST_EURO 9.75
6 EAST_MED 8.27
7 WEST_ASIAN 1.07
8 SOUTH_ASIAN 0.06


# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 81.6% West_&_Central_German + 18.4% French_Basque @ 5.26
2 78.9% English + 21.1% ES @ 5.29
3 65.2% English + 34.8% FR @ 5.4
4 79.5% English + 20.5% PT @ 5.44
5 83.9% NL + 16.1% French_Basque @ 5.51
6 83.8% English + 16.2% North_Italian @ 5.54
7 94.5% Cornish + 5.5% Druze @ 5.54
8 88% Cornish + 12% Tuscan @ 5.61
9 78.8% NL + 21.2% ES @ 5.62
10 86.9% English + 13.1% Tuscan @ 5.63
11 51.7% FR + 48.3% DK @ 5.65
12 86.4% English + 13.6% French_Basque @ 5.67
13 66.5% DK + 33.5% ES @ 5.71
14 64.5% NL + 35.5% FR @ 5.72
15 70.8% Cornish + 29.2% FR @ 5.75
16 93.7% English + 6.3% Sardinian @ 5.75
17 83.9% Cornish + 16.1% PT @ 5.77
18 87.1% Cornish + 12.9% North_Italian @ 5.78
19 94.6% English + 5.4% Druze @ 5.79
20 95.3% Cornish + 4.7% Samaritan @ 5.81
Actually, your profile suggests some Levantine ancestry although it is not a major component. You have 8% eastern Med. Levantine groups such as Samaritans and Druze appear in your Oracles. I don't know where the Druze were tested but Samaritans live in Israel. Historically they were Jews despite the Bible's position.

What about matches.
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  #9  
Old 13th January 2018, 07:58 PM
josh w. josh w. is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by josh w. View Post
Actually, your profile suggests some Levantine ancestry although it is not a major component. You have 8% eastern Med. Levantine groups such as Samaritans and Druze appear in your Oracles. I don't know where the Druze were tested but Samaritans live in Israel. Historically they were Jews despite the Bible's position.

What about matches.
There are signs of Levantine ancestry at Eurogenes. Don't know about Jewish ancestry. However Dodecad points to North African Jews. The common denominator may be Canaanite. A Lebanese study for National Geographic found that Ashkenazis were similar to Lebanese Druze.

Last edited by josh w.; 13th January 2018 at 08:06 PM.
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  #10  
Old 14th January 2018, 08:41 AM
Malo Malo is offline
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Which Gedmatch Admixture do you use to find Sephardic roots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by josh w. View Post
Actually, your profile suggests some Levantine ancestry although it is not a major component. You have 8% eastern Med. Levantine groups such as Samaritans and Druze appear in your Oracles. I don't know where the Druze were tested but Samaritans live in Israel. Historically they were Jews despite the Bible's position.

What about matches.
Hi Josh and thank you for your help.

Regarding matches, I am currently limited to Genesis beta until my FTDNA results come in but I notice that any top matches that I have had (70cM plus) almost always have at least 10% plus Ashkenazi. In addition, there are many lower order matches who seem to have Sephardic names (Nunes, Garza, Jiminez, Vasquez, Perez (10+), Oliveria, Flores etc) but I haven't checked out their ethnicities and to be honest at this stage of my genetic learning, I don't really know what I'm looking at!

When looking at all the various admixtures I seem to get a picture of migration from the Middle East, along the North African coast towards Morocco presumably onto Spain and then back again - which would make sense but who knows.

Last edited by Malo; 14th January 2018 at 08:43 AM. Reason: Error
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