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  #1  
Old 20th February 2018, 05:58 AM
Darkside666 Darkside666 is offline
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Wrong Haplogroup Possibly

Hello all,

Here is my situation, I have completed the Y-37 DNA test to help trace back my origins. I was placed into J-M172(Predicted) and have gotten a hand full of DNA matches with genetic distance ranging from 0-4 with most of them being Montgomery. Problem however is i have not found one single Montgomery in my family tree. Also learning that J-M172 is of a middle eastern origin my Family Finder would suggest i have very little to none ancestry here. I am starting to think i would fit in R-M269 group. Would upgrading my kit to Y-67 or doing full SNP test help rule out or confirm J-M172??
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  #2  
Old 20th February 2018, 06:27 AM
Jim Barrett Jim Barrett is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Timpson, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkside666 View Post
Would upgrading my kit to Y-67 or doing full SNP test help rule out or confirm J-M172??
SNP testing is the only way to confirm a Hoplogroup. In the Y-DNA section of your myFTDNA home page you may see "Get 176 SNPs related to M267 for only $99!" If you are in the J Haplogroup this could be a good starting point. You could order the single M172 SNP.

Adding additional STRs will not change your predicted Haplogroup.
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  #3  
Old 20th February 2018, 07:19 AM
Darkside666 Darkside666 is offline
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Jim,

Thanks for the infomation i do see where i can get 108 SNP pack for J-M172, However how would i add tests for R-M269? Or do you think that doing the SNP pack for J might rule it out and change it to something else?
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  #4  
Old 20th February 2018, 10:35 AM
TwiddlingThumbs TwiddlingThumbs is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkside666 View Post
Hello all,

Here is my situation, I have completed the Y-37 DNA test to help trace back my origins. I was placed into J-M172(Predicted) and have gotten a hand full of DNA matches with genetic distance ranging from 0-4 with most of them being Montgomery. Problem however is i have not found one single Montgomery in my family tree. Also learning that J-M172 is of a middle eastern origin my Family Finder would suggest i have very little to none ancestry here. I am starting to think i would fit in R-M269 group. Would upgrading my kit to Y-67 or doing full SNP test help rule out or confirm J-M172??
Hmmm. . . Montgomery doesn't sound very middle eastern either. Based on a little googling, it looks like there is some J-M172 that may have been in Britain for a long while, perhaps from Roman soldiers. https://j2-m172.info/2016/01/exogeno...ddle-eastener/

If, hypothetically, you were descended from a J-M172 Roman soldier who left a son in Britain or northern Europe, it would not be surprising that your Family Finder results showed no middle eastern ancestry, as probably all the Roman soldier's DNA would have been washed out over the years except for his Y chromosome, which (someone please correct me if I'm wrong) I don't think is part of the Family Finder test.

Re predicted haplotype - I assume that the prediction methods just compare your STR results against the modal values for the different haplotypes and see which is the closest fit. Here are the modal values for R-M269 and J-M172 for 37 markers, so, if you want, you can manually calculate which one you are closer to and how much closer your are to J-M172 than to R-M269.

R-M269 12 24 14 10 11-14 11 12 12 13 13 29 17 9-10 11 11 25 15 19 30 15-15-16-16 11 11 19-23 17 16 18 17 38-38 12 12
J-M172 12 23 14 10 13-16 11 15 11 13 11 29 16 9-9 11 11 26 15 20 29 12-13-15-16 10 10 19-22 15 14 17 17 34-38 11 9

See: http://dgmweb.net/DNA/General/Y-DNA_...aplotypes.html

Since there are modal values for 67 and 111 markers as well, I would think that testing more STRs could result in a different predicted haplotype, although only SNP testing would tell you your actual haplotype rather than just your predicted haplotype.

Last edited by TwiddlingThumbs; 20th February 2018 at 10:39 AM.
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  #5  
Old 20th February 2018, 09:13 PM
TwiddlingThumbs TwiddlingThumbs is offline
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You can also try entering your STR results into this 3d party haplotype predictor, which will calculate the probability that you could be in various haplotypes: https://stevemorse.org/dna/hapest.php
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  #6  
Old 20th February 2018, 09:13 PM
Jim Barrett Jim Barrett is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Timpson, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkside666 View Post
Jim, Thanks for the information I do see where i can get 108 SNP pack for J-M172, However how would i add tests for R-M269? Or do you think that doing the SNP pack for J might rule it out and change it to something else?
You will not be R-M269 if you are part of the J Haplogroup. When signed into your kit click on the upgrade button near the top right. Scroll down to the "Advanced Test" section and click on "Buy Now". In the Filter section click on the down arrow in the Marker box and select SNP. Put M269 in the Find box and click on Find. You can order the SNP for $39. I don't think this would be a good choice until you have done the suggest SNP Pack. If you get J SNPs do not order M269.
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  #7  
Old 20th February 2018, 10:54 PM
MoberlyDrake MoberlyDrake is offline
mtDNA: T2b5 | Y-DNA: J-M172
 
Join Date: May 2010
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Have you done the Family Finder test? If so, are you getting Montgomery matches on it too?
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  #8  
Old 21st February 2018, 05:48 AM
Darkside666 Darkside666 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoberlyDrake View Post
Have you done the Family Finder test? If so, are you getting Montgomery matches on it too?
Yes i have taken the Family Finder Test. I do get some Montgomery's in the Family Finder matches most of which are from other peoples current tree's.
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