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Family Finder Advanced Topics Advanced discussion about Family Tree DNA's Family Finder Product.

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  #1  
Old 30th April 2018, 09:50 AM
mccunney mccunney is offline
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Law Enforcement Access to Family Finder

Recently in the case of the Golden State Killer, law enforcement gained access to the GEDmatch database by formatting the DNA file of the suspected killer in a format that GEDmatch would accept, such as AncestryDNA or 23andMe, and uploading it to GEDmatch. What would keep law enforcement from gaining access to Family Finder by submitting an autosomal DNA transfer of a suspect in the same manner?
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  #2  
Old 30th April 2018, 11:02 AM
Biblioteque Biblioteque is offline
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https://dna-explained.com/2018/04/30...iller-and-dna/

This blog from Roberta Estes today might be helpful.
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  #3  
Old 30th April 2018, 11:03 AM
dna dna is offline
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Please see the other thread with the same title at
http://forums.familytreedna.com/showthread.php?t=43363


Mr. W.
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  #4  
Old 30th April 2018, 03:45 PM
mccunney mccunney is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Biblioteque View Post
https://dna-explained.com/2018/04/30...iller-and-dna/

This blog from Roberta Estes today might be helpful.
The blog is interesting, but does not answer my question whether this same technique used by law enforcement with GEDmatch can be used with Family Finder.

Perhaps the issue centers around the rather poorly worded GEDmatch Term of Service agreement. In order to upload a DNA file to GEDmatch, the user must click a box stating:
"Please acknowledge that any sample you submit is either your DNA or the DNA of a person for whom you are a legal guardian or have obtained authorization to upload their DNA to GEDmatch."

"Have obtained authorization" FROM WHOM "to upload their DNA"? From the person whose DNA it is, or from someone who has legal custody of the DNA, in this case, some law enforcement office?

I cannot find anything that addresses this point in the Family Tree DNA Terms of Service.
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  #5  
Old 30th April 2018, 04:50 PM
JDP1144 JDP1144 is offline
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And why are you so afraid

Are you a felon mass murderer on the loose?
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  #6  
Old 30th April 2018, 04:53 PM
dna dna is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mccunney View Post
The blog is interesting, but does not answer my question whether this same technique used by law enforcement with GEDmatch can be used with Family Finder.

Perhaps the issue centers around the rather poorly worded GEDmatch Term of Service agreement. In order to upload a DNA file to GEDmatch, the user must click a box stating:
"Please acknowledge that any sample you submit is either your DNA or the DNA of a person for whom you are a legal guardian or have obtained authorization to upload their DNA to GEDmatch."

"Have obtained authorization" FROM WHOM "to upload their DNA"? From the person whose DNA it is, or from someone who has legal custody of the DNA, in this case, some law enforcement office?

I cannot find anything that addresses this point in the Family Tree DNA Terms of Service.
Yes. DNA results can be created to look like they originated from AncestryDNA™, 23andMe© or MyHeritage™ and then uploaded to Family Tree DNA. The scientific reasoning would be similar (see bottom of the post for differences).

What can you do?
  1. Do not use any name (not even a fake one) just XX, or YY, or even only ZZ initials.
  2. Use an anonymous e-mail address, something like zz@outlook.com, that is not being used anywhere else.
  3. Do not respond to queries, until you agree with the purpose of those queries.
There is a problem with item 3., since I doubt that anyone can guess whether Jack Brown is a real person or an avatar on top of the reconstructed DNA kit. FTDNA helps in marking kits that are not results of testing at FTDNA, i.e. by marking transferred kits.


For those who test at FTDNA, the agreement is signed by the person DNA providing when signing the green release form ( text can be found at https://www.familytreedna.com/forms/...lease-form.pdf ).

Someone who has transferred autosomal data to FTDNA can probably supply us with a copy or reference to what one acknowledges after transferring the data.


So why would investigators use GEDmatch and not FTDNA? Possibly there are some legal aspects. Possibly a better chance of finding a match at GEDmatch. Possibly they tried everywhere they could.


Mr. W.
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  #7  
Old 30th April 2018, 06:35 PM
MoberlyDrake MoberlyDrake is offline
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I say, if you are a criminal or if you are aware that a close relative is a criminal, don't do any DNA testing. And if you have a close relative whom you know to be a murderer, you should turn them in to the police anyway!
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  #8  
Old 30th April 2018, 06:52 PM
MoberlyDrake MoberlyDrake is offline
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They weren't doing much that every adoptee looking for parents doesn't do. They try to create trees for their very close matches who don't have one posted. I do the same thing and I'm just looking for 4 missing 3rd great-grandparents. If a close match appears from shared matches to be in the right line, I try to create a tree for them. They have to provide some tiny clue to start with. Often I can't get any start. Sometimes, even if I do, I can't get far, and sometimes even if I create a decent tree, I cannot see any common ancestor.

I give up quickly if I can't get a start and if there are too many people with the same name in online directories. I will only put so much time and effort into it. Law officials probably differ in that respect.

I believe adoptees call it creating mirror trees.
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  #9  
Old 1st May 2018, 01:55 AM
mccunney mccunney is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JDP1144 View Post
Are you a felon mass murderer on the loose?
No. I am concerned that users may not wish to participate in the DNA testing community if law enforcement can access the data. Here is a link to a poll conducted by a local TV station that shows about 3 people in 4 are less likely to use a DNA testing service if law enforcement can access it: https://www.facebook.com/wten.albany...60552720235195
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  #10  
Old 1st May 2018, 07:07 AM
Jim Barrett Jim Barrett is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mccunney View Post
The blog is interesting, but does not answer my question whether this same technique used by law enforcement with GEDmatch can be used with Family Finder.
Law Enforcement didn't need to manufacture autosomal results. They had a DNA sample. That sample could be sent to any of many different companies extracting autosomal DNA. The raw data could then be uploaded to any database accepting autosomal DNA. FTDNA, GEDmatch and MyHeritage to name a few.

With a court order they could falsify the required permissions. Did they have a court order? 1. I don't know. 2. I don't care. 3. I glad the caught the man. 4. They still have to prove he is guilty.
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