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  #1  
Old 29th November 2017, 09:05 AM
JMAisHere JMAisHere is offline
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mtDNA happlogroup mapping (how is't defined/done)

I wondering how this mapping of mtDNA at FTDNA is done.

If I get mapped to HV0b and then if I follow the definition on Phylotree and try to map the result given in the mtDNA result page.
I get what is seen below (red marked by me, is result I don't have but are in the branch towards HV0b from phylotree). I have put it in reverse order, outer most leaf at the top. There is actually 3 more marker that's not part of the "path" towards HV0b, I have omitted them (it's not the 309/315/322 that is always discarded, 3 others)
Code:
  1. HV0b C198T
  2. -- T195C!
  3. HV0 T72C T16298C
  4. HV T14766C
  5. R0a'b (T58C) C64T T2442C T16362C
  6. R0 G73A A11719G
  7. R T12705C T16223C
  8. N G8701A C9540T G10398A C10873T A15301G!
  9. L3 A769G A1018G C16311T
  10. L3'4 T182C! T3594C T7256C T13650C T16278C
  11. L3'4'6 G4104A A7521G
  12. L2'3'4'6 C195T A247G A825t T8655C A10688G C10810T G13105A T13506C G15301A A16129G T16187C C16189T
  13. L2'3'4'5'6 C152T A2758G C2885T G7146A T8468C
  14. L1'2'3'4'5'6 C146T C182T T4312C T10664C C10915T A11914G G13276A G16230A
The main curiosity I actually have is for the branching of R0a'b, since you can see I "missing" all the 3 markers that defines this subclade.
How is it that mapping then continue outward towards the leaf, can it not be a totally new R0a'c (or something)?
Is the mapping done so that this subclade is the one that's most likely, with that I mean this is the branch that has least missing marker.
Or is there some weighting involved that marker closer to the root has higher precedence?
FTDNA has a page mtDNA Haplogroup Mutations that state "Required Mutations" but it only mentioning the "leaf" mutation C198T
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  #2  
Old 29th November 2017, 11:54 AM
Emona Emona is online now
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The less interesting part:

14. C182T
Not listed, because it went back to its original state:
10. T182C! (! meaning back mutation)

And two more of the same kind:

12. C195T
2. T195C!

12. G15301A
8. A15301G!

Hope someone knows the more interesting part of the answer.
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  #3  
Old 29th November 2017, 03:03 PM
JMAisHere JMAisHere is offline
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Now I know litle more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emona View Post
The less interesting part:
14. C182T
Not listed, because it went back to its original state:
10. T182C! (! meaning back mutation)

And two more of the same kind:
12. C195T <--> 2. T195C!
12. G15301A <--> 8. A15301G!
Thanks Emona

That was great insight for me, of course the back mutation shall not be present (can't be present and not present at the same time ) So obvious now after you point it out, two much red in my original text.

I have made a new one here, where I greay them out which instead of red, since they shall not be there to follow the path out to the leaf of HV0b

Code:
HV0b		C198T

--		T195C!

HV0		T72C    T16298C

HV		T14766C

R0a'b		(T58C)  C64T    T2442C  T16362C

R0		G73A    A11719G

R		T12705C T16223C

N		G8701A  C9540T  G10398A C10873T A15301G!

L3		A769G   A1018G  C16311T

L3'4		T182C!  T3594C  T7256C  T13650C T16278C

L3'4'6		G4104A  A7521G

L2'3'4'6	C195T   A247G   A825t   T8655C  A10688G C10810T G13105A T13506C G15301A A16129G T16187C C16189T

L2'3'4'5'6	C152T   A2758G  C2885T  G7146A  T8468C

L1'2'3'4'5'6	C146T   C182T   T4312C  T10664C C10915T A11914G G13276A G16230A
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  #4  
Old 29th November 2017, 04:59 PM
Emona Emona is online now
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Got it.
If I am reading the tree http://www.phylotree.org/tree/R0.htm correctly, then:
R0a'b is parallel to HV.
You are not supposed to have R0a'b mutations (T58C) C64T T2442C T16362C.

(T58C): "Mutations between brackets () are recurrent/unstable within the respective clade, or are yet uncertain based on current data."

Now I can go to sleep peacefully.
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  #5  
Old 30th November 2017, 06:15 AM
JMAisHere JMAisHere is offline
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100% crystal clear now

Quote:
Originally Posted by Emona View Post
Got it.
R0a'b is parallel to HV.
You are not supposed to have R0a'b mutations (T58C) C64T T2442C T16362C.
Many thanks Emona

I must obviously learn to be much more careful when I following a path on the phylotree. As you state R0a'b is not above/before HV (in the path). So the path to HV0b is now perfectly according to phylotree.
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