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  #1  
Old 22nd December 2017, 07:09 PM
rmm0484 rmm0484 is offline
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Need Some Help on no Y match, but plenty of Autosomal matches

Hello, all:

I am the keeper of my extended family tree, to include my brother in law (BIL) and his DNA. I traced his Dean line back to around the time of the Mayflower, but the Dean family tree DNA project manager says BIL's Y DNA is not that of the "Colonial Deans."

Fair enough, I said to myself, I know about NPEs and all. However, my BIL has a significant number of autosomal matches to that line of Deans and their respective collateral lines, such as Pratt ad Edson. I can probably come up with at least ten matches to people with the correct surnames to the Colonial line.

What are some interpretations?
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  #2  
Old 22nd December 2017, 07:30 PM
georgian1950 georgian1950 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmm0484 View Post
Hello, all:
What are some interpretations?
I compare autosomal matching methodology for distant matching to a Rorschach Test. People see what they want to see.

If the BIL is claiming a paternal line to the Mayflower Dean's, but his DNA is not matching DNA for established lines, that is pretty conclusive.

Jack Wyatt
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  #3  
Old 22nd December 2017, 11:09 PM
ltd-jean-pull ltd-jean-pull is offline
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A possible scenario is that an unmarried Dean daughter had a son that was raised by the grandparents as their child. So he has Dean ancestry, but not in his patrilineal line.
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  #4  
Old 23rd December 2017, 01:10 PM
rmm0484 rmm0484 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by georgian1950 View Post
I compare autosomal matching methodology for distant matching to a Rorschach Test. People see what they want to see.

If the BIL is claiming a paternal line to the Mayflower Dean's, but his DNA is not matching DNA for established lines, that is pretty conclusive.

Jack Wyatt
LOL! BIL is not claiming, I found these lines myself. He absolutely matches many of the correct Dean lines and their spouses, just autosomally, not to the YDNA paper trail that I set up.
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  #5  
Old 23rd December 2017, 02:03 PM
MoberlyDrake MoberlyDrake is online now
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Do I understand correctly that several people who trace their paternal lines directly back to the Mayflower Dean all match each other on a Y-DNA test of at least 37 (preferably more) markers with only small genetic differences? It's important that several people from different lines have tested. And you have traced your direct paternal ancestors back to this same line of Deans, not by copying internet trees, which are mostly trash, but by carefully obtaining and evaluating primary documents???

If all of the above is true, than you have a non-paternity event of some kind somewhere in your line.
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  #6  
Old 23rd December 2017, 03:37 PM
MoberlyDrake MoberlyDrake is online now
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If you don't match Dean, do you have any matches at all? And does one surname clearly predominate, or do you have matches with a variety of surnames?
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  #7  
Old 23rd December 2017, 05:33 PM
The_Contemplator The_Contemplator is offline
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I've seen a similar situation. Different region and surname groups. The reason your BIL matches through autosomal DNA is that he may still descend from those Deans or other common ancestors, just not through his paternal line.

In one surname group we noticed that two sets of men were claiming the same ancestor who was born in the early 1600's. However these two sets did not match Y-DNA. They weren't even the same haplogroup. One being R-M269 and the other J-M267. We put their paternal lineages together and it became obvious what happened.

Group A (R-M269) had their most recent common ancestor from the 1600's (son of the ancestor I mention earlier). Group B (J-M267) had their most recent common ancestor from the 1700's. So Group B's most recent common ancestor was Group A's ancestor's descendant based on records. The conclusion we have is that Group A are the true paternal descendants while Group B came from an undocumented NPE a few generations afterwards.

However, these two groups lived in the same region for a few centuries. They are autosomal matches to each other. Which is basically what you are seeing with your BIL's Dean line. He has an NPE but is still related to those true Dean's through other branches.
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  #8  
Old 26th December 2017, 07:35 PM
rmm0484 rmm0484 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoberlyDrake View Post
If you don't match Dean, do you have any matches at all? And does one surname clearly predominate, or do you have matches with a variety of surnames?
He matches no Mayflower Deans through YDNA, but he has autosomal Dean matches, as well as autosomally matching many of the other surnames connected to the early Mayflower Deans, such as Pratt, and the later lines such as Coombs.
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  #9  
Old 26th December 2017, 10:38 PM
JDP1144 JDP1144 is offline
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There are no Mayflower Deans

Stephen Deane was in Plymouth, MA but he arrived in 1621 on the "Fortune" and he had no sons.
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