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Announcements and New Features Announcements of changes at Family Tree DNA and to the FTDNA website. This is also for general communications by FTDNA staff.

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  #1  
Old 18th March 2015, 09:53 PM
Darren Darren is offline
Customer Support Specialist
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 852
Y-DNA Haplogroup prediction changes March 2015

Hello all, wanted to pass along a message from management:

When we released the new Y-DNA Haplotree last spring, we were hopeful that we would be able to improve our ability to predict deep haplogroup branches. As we have continued to update the tree, we have learned several valuable lessons. One of those has been the deeper level predictions do not carry the reliability we require and that testers deserve.

In working with our customers to confirm the predictions, we have found that the small group tests we performed are not working universally on the large group level. The result of this lesson is that we are returning everyone’s predictions to the reliable SNP Assurance Program level to ensure everyone receives a prediction that is 100% accurate. For more information on the SNP Assurance Program, click here: https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/...nce-program-2/

We had intended to prepare you and your group project administrators before we started re-running the predictions. Our team was excited by the new process and we unintentionally released the first of the re-predictions before making the announcement. Our R-haplogroup people may already see changes to their predictions. We apologize for the surprise, confusion and some frustration this may cause. We will be continue to re-run predictions in the next few weeks as we update other branches of the tree. In addition, over the next few weeks we will release several of our new Deep Clade tests that will in part begin to replace the need for single SNP testing as these panels are large, robust and very moderately priced.

We encourage customers to work with their group project administrators, especially haplogroup administrators, to determine the best SNPs for them to order to confirm their branch, and our hope is that returning to our previous prediction standard will ease this process for everyone. We appreciate your patience and support as we continue to research and developed the new Y-tree.
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  #2  
Old 18th March 2015, 11:53 PM
Fred Fred is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 5
New R haplogroup classification moots an SNP test?

I was re-classified from R-173 to R-M269. I have a P-25 SNP result due in the next few weeks. This test now appears pointless. What options do I have in cancelling or requesting a refund for this test?
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  #3  
Old 19th March 2015, 12:26 AM
dna dna is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,673
I would say that a prediction is not the same as determination, and would not cancel the test.

W. (Mr.)
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  #4  
Old 19th March 2015, 06:55 AM
T E Peterman T E Peterman is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,575
I think predictions are only relevant to people that have done no SNP testing.

At this point, there are soooo many SNP tests to choose from that dollar for dollar, it would probably be a more sensible value to do the Big Y test & all of the novel variants that come with it. But if you do so, please join the relevant project & let the administrators have access to your BAM file. This is how new branches of the y-haplotree are discovered today.

Timothy Peterman
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  #5  
Old 19th March 2015, 09:54 AM
Sarmat Sarmat is offline
R1a-YP444*, H2a2a1
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 615
It would appear that in addition to just revising how the predictions are handled, this update actually revised FTDNA's haplotree itself.

I was formerly CTS11962+, but now I'm one node further down the tree at L1029+ (which was previously not included on FTDNA's tree).

Both of these are SNP confirmed by Big Y, though my terminal SNP at this point actually appears to be YP444*, which is several nodes down the tree from L1029.
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  #6  
Old 19th March 2015, 10:12 AM
381858 381858 is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 41
Less Accurate

I too was surprised to find my R-L21 gone and replaced with R-M269 (or something). The change is misleading because I know from 23andme and from ancestry.com raw results filtered through Prometheus that R-L21 is the correct one.

I have a SNP test on order to try to get a lower terminal SNP than R-L21, but this business of going in the wrong direction (albeit temporarily) is annoying.
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  #7  
Old 19th March 2015, 10:21 AM
MikeP MikeP is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 311
Does this extra effort regarding haplotypes have anything to do with the delays for y-dna tests for batches 603 onwards?
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  #8  
Old 19th March 2015, 10:29 AM
dna dna is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,673
Quote:
Originally Posted by 381858 View Post
I too was surprised to find my R-L21 gone and replaced with R-M269 (or something). The change is misleading because I know from 23andme and from ancestry.com raw results filtered through Prometheus that R-L21 is the correct one.

I have a SNP test on order to try to get a lower terminal SNP than R-L21, but this business of going in the wrong direction (albeit temporarily) is annoying.
You know the results of your SNP test for L21, and that is the accurate and definite information about L21. FTDNA is making predictions based on STRs.

My understanding of the announcement is that some STR results had been found in the FTDNA database that the STR data were the same, but the Y-DNA belonged to halogroups at different branches (as determined by SNP testing performed later). Thus FTDNA decided to assign a more general haplogroup when doing predictions - they cannot really do anything else, since they would be giving out a wrong assignment to some. And I understood that there were many situations like that.

The above is some simplification, as FTDNA has SNP Assurance Program https://www.familytreedna.com/learn/...nce-program-2/

W. (Mr.)

Last edited by dna; 19th March 2015 at 10:43 AM.
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  #9  
Old 19th March 2015, 12:24 PM
keigh keigh is offline
FTDNA Customer
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 461
When I first tested my Y-DNA to twelve markers I was predicted as R-M269 then as I tested farther, the prediction went to R-L21. Now I'm back at M269 with 67 markers tested. I understand why the prediction went one way and now is stepping back. And at this point I think I'll just leave it as the 111 marker test just costs too much. Maybe someday I'll see a point to digging really deeply into my genetics, but at the moment I'm interested in my more recent genealogy.
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  #10  
Old 19th March 2015, 04:06 PM
A.Lock A.Lock is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: FL
Posts: 85
Quote:
Originally Posted by keigh View Post
When I first tested my Y-DNA to twelve markers I was predicted as R-M269 then as I tested farther, the prediction went to R-L21. Now I'm back at M269 with 67 markers tested. I understand why the prediction went one way and now is stepping back. And at this point I think I'll just leave it as the 111 marker test just costs too much. Maybe someday I'll see a point to digging really deeply into my genetics, but at the moment I'm interested in my more recent genealogy.
I just hope this isn't a ploy to get more cash from the customers.
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